According to a tweet from Jon Heyman of Sports Illustrated, the Jays and White Sox have talked this off-season about power-hitting right-handed outfielder Carlos Quentin, but the talks have cooled and the White Sox are now looking elsewhere.

OK? Cue Joe Cowley anti-Toronto hysteria. Looks like someone’s setup a Chicago campus of the @Damospin School of Hack Journalism and Social Media Trolling!

Quentin’s is a name I thought the Jays might look at, as he can hit for power and take a walk. Although, that’s about it, really. He’s not much defensively– metrics like UZR and DRS vary pretty wildly from year to year– and has had trouble staying healthy, so… it’s not like the price should be so high– which, obviously, is where the clubs disagreed. He’d be an interesting DH, I suppose, or as the lefty-mashing right-hander in a left field platoon, perchaps. I dunno…

UPDATE: Richard Griffin of the Toronto Star adds that the Jays and ChiSox also discussed pitcher John Danks and second baseman Gordon Beckham, but settled on just moving Sergio Santos for Nestor Molina “… for now.”

It makes sense: the White Sox are one of the few teams openly rebuilding, and the Jays, with their loaded farm system, could help them a lot and help themselves in the process by taking some of their MLB pieces. I wouldn’t be surprised, given that Alex Anthopoulos and Ken Williams obviously have a good relationship, if they found a match again before the winter is through.

Crotch grab to @RayIrwin for being the first to point this out to me. And MLBTR, as always, catching it too.

Comments (51)

  1. I was thinking he might work in a platoon situation (taking AB’s away from either Snider/Thames or Lind against LHP) but he actually has a higher career OPS against righties (.840) than lefties (.826). 

    I guess he fits for the Jays if they really don’t have any faith in Snider or Thames, but one of the things Farrell said he wanted in LF this year was better defence, so Quentin wouldn’t be a very good option there. As a DH, the cost to acquire him would have to be low enough that it doesn’t eclipse the marginal improvement he’d be over EE, especially considering his injury history. I don’t hate the idea of acquiring him, but it also doesn’t seem like a great fit right now.

  2. The opinion on Quentin is quite varied, and rightfully so.  At 29 he’s just hitting his prime.  A late bloomer but can’t stay healthy.  Has hit 36 HR’s before, and never less than than 21 (in only 399 AB’s.)  Realistically he’s a 25-30 HR guaranteed power guy with the potential to hit 35 or so.  HR hitters are a rar(er) breed these days than they used to be.

    He doesn’t strike out like a lot of power guys do and he’s a gamer.  He gets hit by pitches more than anyone else in baseball.

    I can see why the Jays would argue he should come cheap, and I can see why the Sox would ask for more.

  3. I’d like to add that a comparible to him might be Nelson Cruz.  Like Cruz, when Quentin gets hot he gets on fire.  He’s a guy who could pretty much single-handedly win you a playoff series if he’s hitting at the right time.

  4. He doesn’t strike out like a lot of power guys do and he’s a gamer.  He gets hit by pitches more than anyone else in baseball.

    I don’t know if that makes him a “gamer” so much as just a “guy who stands too close to the plate”. It’s also worth noting that his OBP is wildly inflated by those HBP numbers — in 2011, he reached base almost as often via HBP (23 times) as he did by taking a walk (34 times). If anything, I think that decreases his value.

  5. Unless he can simgle handedly get the Jays to a playiff series, I’ll say pass.

  6. I think we can disagree on this.  I see what you mean by his ‘eye for the plate’ might be unjustified by his HBP totals, but it would appear that Quentin has made the HBP part of his game…most of those 23 are not coincidental or result of wild pitches.  I call it a gamer because it would appear that he’ll do whatever he needs to do to get on base.

  7. Would be nice to have him, Lind and EE all rotating and sharing time at 1st and DH

  8. They also talked about Danks apparently (and Beckham who was already rumoured).  Safe to say AA probably talked about all the Sox players who might fit this club in some way.

  9. How many of his injuries came from his being hit by a pitch?

  10. I’m not really crazy on him.  Nice power and decent OBP .. but yeah, health has got to be a concern.  Has never played more than 131 games in a season. 

    Plus I think I’d rather see Thames or Snider (preferably Snider) get a chance in the OF.

    Maybe you DH Quentin and have one of Thames or Snider play LF and have E5 and Lind split 1st?

    Or maybe this deal was talked about in the event that Thames and/or Snider were dealt.

  11. I’d like the Jays to give Snider the approach that the Royals gave Alex Gordon last winter.  Completely revamp his approach at the plate and then plant him as the starting left fielder, sink or swim.  For some reason the Jays hold the line that there’s nothing wrong with Sniders mechanics but from what I saw last year he has a long, long ways to go.  Thames is not a starting left fielder.  And you can’t have platoons all over the field.  I wouldn’t be surpirsed one bit if the Jays deal Thames or Snider this winter. 

    Personally I’d like to see Thames dealt because he projects, ultimately, as a reserve outfielder and his defense is poor.  To be honest I don’t even really see how Thames fits in this organization long-term.  His trade value might be at it’s peak right now.

  12. Just because the Jays talked about Quentin doesn’t mean they wanted him to play for their team. I’m sure Anthopoulos would know his market and if other teams would be interested in him. I wouldnt read too much into the “Jays don’t have faith in Snider/Thames” theory. Quentin could have been flipped to fill another hole in the roster, its not like Anthopoulos has a history of doing that…

  13. Never forget that Jon pathologically makes things up.

  14. Trade for him just so Joe Cowley can write even more shit about Canada, and then we can watch and laughed as he gets pissed on by his colleagues

  15. Hmm, I don’t think that’s accurate re: Jays’ stance on Snider’s mechanics. The reason they sent him down to AAA last year was ostensibly to revamp his mechanics because they were all messed up. There was a huge emphasis on fixing his mechanics. I remember Farrell/AA’s response whenever asked about Snider’s performance in AAA was always “we don’t care about results right now, we’re looking for him to make the necessary changes to his swing mechanics, that’s what we care about.”

    The good news is that by most accounts, he was figuring things out and getting himself right again in August, but then he got hurt and never had a chance to test it at the major league level. Hopefully the changes worked though, and hopefully they’ll stick next year. He was definitely a mess at the plate in 2011, but the Jays were pretty open in acknowledging that.

  16. Absolutely, but I do disagree with your notion that not too much should be read into the Thames/Snider theory.  You can’t field an entire team of potential and expect to win, and LF is one of the easiest positions to fill in baseball.   The Jays have so many players who come with the labels “if” (JPA, Lind, KJ, Lawrie, Rasmus, EE…that’s 6 of the 9 starters!) that I’m certain AA would upgrade at LF at the expense of seeing what they have in Snider/Thames duo if he can, so long as it doesn’t cost them an arm and a leg to do so.

    In fact, finding a veteran, reliable LF’er who makes this team better right now who can play there for a year or two and trading a young player like Thames/Snider for pitching help, when they know they have Gose and Marisnick coming, makes a lot of sense.

  17. Cowley is such a stupid cockstain.

  18. Wow Cowley got me so fucking pissed off. It took the socks 110 years to win three world series, while the Jays have won two in 44 years. I hope he can go fuck himself.

  19. If you google Cowley, he basically shits on every city that isn’t Chicago.  It’s not just a Toronto thing.

    He’s an idiot.  Nobody takes him seriously.  (IE Blue Jays should move to Venezuela).

  20. Geoff Baker shits hard on Rogers in his latest blog:


  21. Cowley has even ripped on the Chicago teams at time too.  Being a white sox fan yes Quentin has had some injuries but the first time he went down 2008 was from breaking his wrist hitting his bat after a strike out. This year he lost the rest of the season cause he made a awesome catch but wind up messing up his shoulder and had to get surgery. So he caused one injury on his own and did another from making a catch, not like these are lingering issues. Also he had turf tow in there to but that seems to be gone.

  22. this is for the idiots who think trumbo is crap.  first full year playing:

    trumbo 251/291/477  29hr 573pa

    player A 242/316/448 19hr 443pa

    player B 233/282/404 15hr 579pa

    player C 214/298/349 5hr 263 pa (2nd year)

    player D 266/308/468 13hr 287pa (2nd year)

    player E 249/298/402 11hr 429pa

    tell me if you’d want any of those 5 players? all started out low obp guys and then…

    after you say no I’ll tell you who they are. or you can guess.
    Edit Reply

  23. I hate to say it, he does make a good point here and there, but the basic flaws in logic are pretty horrible. Maybe he needs to take an accounting class first before he starts to comment on stuff he obviously has no clue about. I guess when you’re desperate to try and spin facts to a point of view you’ll write just about anything. Just another example of the sad state of journalism out there these days. Very lazy.

  24. There’s not one year where anyone on your list had an OPS over .800. If they’re not playing a prime defensive position but are playing  a corner outfield or infield spot I’d say there’s nothing to write home about, just like Trumbo.

  25. Remind me,
    Mud Pie is the kid who thinks the Orioles are further ahead in the process than Toronto?

  26. That was a fantastic article.  He nailed it.  I liked the point about how rogers has been stockpiling cash just to buy a hockey team. The fact is, this is what myself and BFF have been complaining about to all the sheep that blindly agree with the jays not spending any money.  Time to hold rogers accountable and stop showing up to games until they pony up.

  27. Interesting read. I dont think he shits too hard other than to state the obvious. It is interesting to remember that the team did inject a lot of money into the payroll once upon a time. You would think with the current level of the Canadian dollar and inflation, the $120,000,000 payroll figure is attainable if and when AA is ready to pull the trigger.

  28. The main problems with his is article is some of the financial stuff. He’s equating spending less on payroll with growing franchise value. That’s about as stupid as you can get. Especially since it’s a wholly owned division of a corporation. If they were a separate entity taking any excess profits generated by having low payrolls vs high revenues and sitting on it as cash or securities that’s one thing, however, that’s not the case. That’s like saying my house should sell more because I paid down my mortgage faster.

  29. I love Jeff Bakers article.  Sure you can nit-pick about some of what he says, but the general idea is correct IMO.  Rogers runs this team the same way MLSE ran the Leafs, and that is 100% with an eye on revenue and 0% emotional investment in the on-field product.  Somehow I think it’s important for there to be a blend of both.  A sports franchise is not a telecommunications company and while I get that both are businesses, one has a historical and intangible thread in the history of both the team, it’s fans, and the owners legacy…while the other…is still just a telecommunications business.  They should not be run the same.

  30. Mudpie, you have to put the ages in too! It’s slightly relevant.

  31. instant trade: snider/thames + cecil/drabek+ pick your top pitching prospect for quentin + beckham

  32. i meant to say a hutcison/syyndergard etc…

  33. Ummm No.

  34. Beckham is kind of erroneous now that Johnson is back, no?

  35. Trumbo is JP Arencibia with no defensive value..

    one finishes 2nd in ROY voting and one doesn’t get a vote. go figure

    either way,  Trumbo is a player who can’t help the jays, we have enough potential sub .300 OBP guys on our team already

  36. did you just call your friend your bff? lol

  37. even worse of a trade idea

  38. Cowley is an idiot overall, but his anti-hockey sentiments must be repeated over and over and preached as gospel.  Fucking useless, annoying sport.

  39. Josh Willingham is a better hitter than Carlos Quentin and is available for money, as opposed to having to trade away value.

  40. “if” Gose can hit….

  41. I’m still trying to figure out why the Jays would actually consider trading for Quentin. Seems like such a lateral move. Danks isn’t a bad idea; his numbers against the AL East, aside from the Yankees, are very respectable. Maybe the Jays go after someone like Ervin Santana? Unlikely with the Angels gearing up for a possible run in 2012, but that’d be kinda awesome.

  42. Willingham is a type A.  And while the difference isn’t substantial, Quentin pretty clearly has more power and is better.

  43. He’s a modified Type A, like Kelly Johnson. Won’t cost the Jays anything to sign in terms of draft picks.

    Over the last 3 years Willingham holds a 25 point advantage in OBP with the same SLG, and that’s with Quentin being the one to play in a hitter’s environment.

  44. Ah, I missed the modified Type A part

  45. the word would be redundant.

  46. I actually meant to say superfluous, but that works too.

    I do appreciate the correction on a comment I posted from my phone while pooping. Keep up the good work.

  47. here’s another player with no obp skills:

    2nd year 255/271/373 229pa
    3rd year 273/300/386 733pa

    who is this shitty player? he now has a 100mil contract!!!! how can this be??????

  48. ok sure

    trumbo 251/291/477  29hr 573pa AGE 25

    player A 242/316/448 19hr 443pa AGE 24

    player B 233/282/404 15hr 579pa AGE 21

    player C 214/298/349 5hr 263 pa (2nd year) AGE 24

    player D 266/308/468 13hr 287pa (2nd year) AGE 25

    player E 249/298/402 11hr 429pa AGE 24

    player F 273/300/386 733pa 3rd year AGE 22

    ok so tell me would you have wanted any of these players at these ages? most were about the same age as trumbo

  49. Ive said it before and I will say it again…

    A. trade for or sign a very dangerous hitter to hit behind Bautista. Imagine his numbers if he didnt lose 200 at bats on walks + getting better pitches to hit. And imagine the numbers a dangerous hitter would put up behind Bautista. Be it Quentin, Fielder, etc etc.


    B. trade Bautista for a truckload of ready or near ready prospects. One writer suggested the Angels offer Trout, Trumbo and more for Bautista to play 3B… not a bad trade for a bunch of guys that would fit the age group of the rebuild.

    BOTTOM LINE: Stop fucking wasting Bautistas prime for fuck sakes. Either insulate him in the line up or trade him, thats it, thats all. Stop being a pussy about this 6th year for Fielder and make it happen. Does AA not realize that a guy like Fielder would make the Jays one of the best 1-9 line ups in baseball?

    1. Escobar
    2. Rasmus
    3. Bautista
    4. Quentin,Fielder etc etc
    5. Lawrie
    6. Lind
    7. Johnson
    8. Thames
    9. Arencibia

    Think about that… now think about it IF Thames, Lawrie and Arencibia continue to develop, if Rasmus gets right and even if Lind, Johnson and Escobar stay as is… that is a fucking terrifying line up, I dont care who is on the mound, someone is getting to him and there isnt much room to pitch around anyone.

    Just saying…. one or the other. Bautista would crush even better with a hitter to insulate him and he could also bring in a shitload for the rebuild. The grey area is wasting his prime and that would not be acceptable.

  50. Quentin can’t get us to the playoffs by himself. Don’t make the trade. 

  51. Are you seriously trying to compare Jose Reyes to Mark Trumbo? This feels almost remedial but let’s go over all the reasons that’s ridiculous:

    1. Jose Reyes plays SS. Mark Trumbo plays 1B.
    2. Jose Reyes broke into the MLB as a twenty-year-old. Twenty! Mark Trumbo’s rookie season came when he was 25. That is an enormous difference.
    3. Jose Reyes got a $100 million contract because he became an premier offensive player as he continued to develop – a reasonable expectation for a top prospect who started his MLB career at an incredibly young age. His sub-par offence in his first few MLB years were because he was TWENTY. At that age, Mark Trumbo was playing his first of two years in Low A ball. 

    You know what, this is just silly. Mark Trumbo sucks, and fortunately the people who make baseball decisions for the Blue Jays are aware of that.

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