It’s hard to take Jim Bowden seriously most times, for a number of reasons, and specifically on the issue of what’s going on with Yu Darvish, as he mistakenly tweets that the club who has won the bidding “have until Tues to complete a deal,” which is actually when the 30-day negotiating window starts. But that doesn’t mean he’s not plugged in, or that we shouldn’t be excited by the fact that he says he has “multiple sources cooberating [sic] the NY Post Report that the Blue Jays won the bidding for Yu Darvish.”

So… there’s that.

Comments (93)

  1. I just came.

  2. Please God.

  3. Well, as long everybody’s cooberating, I’m sure it will work out.

  4. Where the fuck did you find that picture? Amazing. 

  5. how exactly do you cooberate something?

  6. bowden is cooberating on that poor girl

  7. ?  picture is when Bowden was out with Dan Lozano

  8. Will this be the make or break move that defines AA? Probably…

  9. Off season for baseball should be a case study in shoddy journalism for all future journalism students.

  10. Nah I don’t  think so. Whether he can get the Jays to the playoffs or not will be what defines him. Rogers willingness to impart resources and a good dose of luck will be large factors in that.

  11. hope it was good for YU

  12. This will suck so hard if it turns out the Jays didn’t win.

  13. From Griffin:

    No change in Darvish news tho Japanese source reports Japan believes Jays have won bidding

  14. That really does look like a young Jessica Simpson

  15. Let’s thank all the passionate fans who came to the ballpark and increased attendance during the month of December to make this happen.

  16. http://espn.go.com/blog/new-yo

    There’s a little bit about how some clubs insure, or in the Mets case, choose not to.  I guess that’s one more cost people need to think about when we’re all clamoring for these big contracts. Still for the clubs that do get insurance, it really does lower the risk premium, and more importantly (and ironically I suppose) makes the club more secure as the contract nears it’s completion. Something else to think about when people start to scream and yell about year 6 and 7 on these long contracts.

  17. Why is that man staring at that woman’s chest?  Her face is higher up.

  18. PICTURED: The night Bowden went under Lozano`s wing.

  19. Can we speculate on top of a speculation?  IF the Jays do win the posting for Darvish, what is the cost to actually sign him in terms of $$$ and years?

  20. Japanese media also saying the jays won with a bid of about $45 million. Woooo Yuuuuu!

  21. How does that christmas song go again? Oh yeah, “All I want for Christmas is you…erh…I mean Yu!”

  22. i goobernate that we shouldn’t get excited yet

  23. Refresh….refresh….refresh…..  admit it, sports is just the guys version of fucking soap operas….

  24. Not soap operas… Sports is our version of celebrity gossip. Its our version of TMZ and People.

  25. Do u guys know that on mlb.com thay r saying that the jays purposely summited a high bid with no intentions of signing him only to cock block teams like the yankees…bullshit! Fuckin Jeff Nelson! He sucked as a pitcher now he sucks as an analyst!
    http://mediadownloads.mlb.com/

  26.  5/75, I’d imagine. He makes $6mm right now, plus an additional $6mm from other sources, so he’d like to top $12mm per year.

  27. Saw this from Griff.  But again, is this independent info or are they just listening to the American rumour mill?

  28. Anyone else find it suspicious that the Cubs now intend to seriously go after Fielder once the Darvish thing is over…..kinda smacks of them losing the Darvish bid…..they prob´ly wouldn´t go after both.

  29. I saw that. Hes a fucking clown. To say that was their only goal is absurd

  30. Correction YU just came

  31. Yep, Wrestling is  the Soap Opera for guys

  32. meh i dont think any 1 move can make or break a gm… the halladay trade was huge, his aquisitions of esco, morrow, rasmus all big.

    even if darvish goes mike sirotka on our ass he’s still 1 hell of a GM imo.

    HUGE move tho no doubt about it.

  33. Jeff Nelson is a piece of shit

  34. well it starts with dice k’s deal…6 for 52.  i have heard he wants a shorter deal …which we may be reluctant to give after the whopping post…i know everyone wants to avoid long term deals but isnt this 1 scenario where you WANT a longer term deal?  gives more value to the initial investment. he is only 25…you don’t post 50M unless your all in on the guy.  purely spec but i’d guess 5 for 55 with a 6th year team option at around 12-14per and a 6th year mutual option at the same rate.

    thoughts?

  35. were you watching legends of the fall again?

  36. Not sure if you caught AA on TSN radio earlier today:

    http://www2.tsn.ca/window/podc

  37. let’s talk about something new, I’d put a Yu darvish signing, or a prince signing, right on par with an evan longoria type deal for brett lawrie

  38. He certainly is keeping any type of excitement contained.  He is one of the better poker faced GM’s out there.

  39. that nelson and his croonie are talking like their assinine opinions are fact is what erks me.  its plausible the jays dont sign him but to suggest they’re not operating in good faith and that its a foregone conclusion he’ll go back to japan if the jays win the bid is fucking redonkulous.

    jeff nelson thinks like he throws…retardedly.

  40. I can’t imagine a 5 year deal being worth it if their bid was north of 45M.  They’d end up paying at least 50/5 and the Jays would be on the hook for almost 20M a year for 25 y/o without any MLB experience.  Best case scenario is a 50/5 deal with a boatload of team options into the future.  I’d be thrilled to see him for the Jays but the numbers being thrown around are NOT worth it.

  41. He should come out to Blur as his theme song.  I know its Woo-hoo, but its close enough.

  42. Man, I would not want to play poker
    with AA, he’s good at keeping his cards close to the vest. In trying to
    decipher his comments I get the sense that they really like Yu. Even though
    there is a risk in signing him or any player for that matter, he cited their
    thought process with the Bautista contract. I’m paraphrasing  but it
    sounds like they view each player as unique and while you look at other players
    for comparisons its more important to look in-depth at the specific player and
    make your decision based on that. That comment to me says for them Yu is like nobody
    who has come out of Japan previously and based on all of the analysis we have
    heard you are looking at a potential ace here. Just what the Jays are looking
    for and need.

  43. Listening to that interview with AA, man, I would not want to play poker
    with AA, he’s good at keeping his cards close to the vest. In trying to
    decipher his comments I get the sense that they really like Yu. Even though
    there is a risk in signing him or any player for that matter, he cited their
    thought process with the Bautista contract. I’m paraphrasing  but it
    sounds like they view each player as unique and while you look at other players
    for comparisons it’s more important to look in-depth at the specific player and
    make your decision based on that. That comment to me says for them Yu is like nobody
    who has come out of Japan previously and based on all of the analysis we have
    heard you are looking at a potential ace here. Just what the Jays are looking
    for and need.

  44. If you sign Darvish, why not sign Feilder? that puts us over the tome and some would argue is a better signign than Wilson/Pujols. It would definetly put us ahead of the Rays for a playoff spot. If we sign both of them I can see a playoff picture of NYY, BOS, TOR, ANA, DET.

  45. greg zaun doesnt like the potential signing solely bc previous japanese starters have failed previous to him.

    conversely…previously admitted juice pigs with horrendous facial hair have largely failed in their pursuits of becoming successful tv analysts.

    zaunie actually grew on my this last season but to say darvish isnt worth the investment solely bc people from the same country have failed previous to him puts him in jeff nelson territory.

  46. Although, his endorsements from Japan might stay the same, maybe even go up. Plus, he would get new N.A endorsements.

  47. With Matt Moore coming in to their already solid rotation, it wouldn’t be a lock.

  48. Also, his contract option with Hokkaido for 2012 is for ~$8.5m.

  49. I wonder if they go with 4 years and a series of options after that. Make the 5th-7th years teams options but for much more money as an incentive for the player to do well. If he does then he earns it. If not, being that they’re team options then nothing lost. Also takes the a little bit of the sting out of the first 4 years and offers the Jays payroll flexibility during the supposed prime contention years.  Maybe you need to sweeten that for Darvish a little with an upfront signing bonus of some kind.

  50. I have been a Zaun supporter since the day he spoke up regarding Shea Hillenbrand, the ultimate douche bag…i’ll forgive his opinion on this one.

  51. On paper, they would be a playoff contender. But paper doesn’t mean anything.

  52. Agreed, but… 4 AL East teams in the hunt in September… ulcer territory… you have got to be at least a little excited. Right now I feel like my kids will in a week! I bet my eyes are fucking “glowing”.

  53. Give Zaunnie some credit tho…he did say that he thinks it would be wiser for the jays to use all that $$$ spent on Yu to sign Prince instead. Personnally I don’t mind who we get aslong as we get one of them (would love both tho). This shows me that the jays r commited to winning this year! I still think if we get Yu and someone like Beltran and trade for Gio (bait’em with Snider), it would definately put us on top!!!

  54. Peeps…We r very close to contending!!

  55. I’ve been checking Cubs blogs.  They are hoping that Darvish will refuse to play in TO and demand the opportunity to play elsewhere.  I would imagine that would have been a conversation held in Japan when AA went out there to scout, but there it is.

    Also the Cubs blogs are nowhere near All Darvish All The Time like this one is.

  56. If all of this Darvish talk is true, it sure explains AA’s comments on payroll parameters last week. If Rogers truly wants Darvish, I can totally see them putting a limit on what he could do and spend at the meetings on other deals at least until they see what the total cost is to secure Darvish. That in itself would be frustrating to AA if they can’t secure Darvish then some of the deals he could have done are no longer available.

  57. I think the price Gio is rumored to be commanding is outrageous. If we lose Darvish I hope we don’t end up getting desperate. Rather wait and see if Morrow, Cecil, Alvarez and Drabek actually have it or not than trade away the future for someone that hasn’t exactly dominated in the AL East. Even getting Yu this winter doesn’t necessarily make us a contender. If it’s one more season of experience  and one more winter of additions to do that without sinking us into a hole then so be it.

  58.  Agreed. I seriously doubt the Jays would have posted anything near a winning bid if they had a hint that Darvish would refuse to play in Toronto. They no doubt would have been more active in other areas last week knowing Darvish was an impossibility.

  59. I like Zaun in general, but he came down really hard on Tyler Beede and other draftees with his “we’d never be that greedy in my day” schtick. At least he’s being consistent in his disdain for throwing large gobs of money at unproven players, even if I don’t necessarily agree with him in this case.

    At some point you have to trust your scouting, and recent history would suggest that the Jays do a pretty good job of that. If they truly believe that Darvish can be a #1 or #1 light starter like Ricky Romero, that can be had without selling the farm, they’re doing the right thing in going hard after him.

  60. You touch on a good point:  don´t you think pretty much any potential problems would have been discussed and hashed out BEFOREHAND.  Far from being an undesirable location, maybe T.O. is a place he really wants to come to…

  61. “I seriously doubt the Jays would have posted anything near a winning bid if they had a hint that Darvish would refuse to play in Toronto”

    Why? If you don’t sign him, you get the posting fee back. If you don’t sign him, the next best outcome is that nobody else signs him either. No reason not to bid just because you don’t think he wants to come; perhaps even the opposite. Knowing the posting system is likely to change, this may be the last chance to game that system to avoid a competitor making an unfortunate acquisition. Many think Oakland did that with Iwakuma last year, and not just Don Nomura.

  62. Everyone needs to calm down a bit. These are just rumours. No one really knows for sure. People are just speculating. I want to get crazy excited about this guy, heck, I’ve had dreams about him playing for the Jays (not the gay kind), but I don’t want to have my heart-on crushed if on Tuesday they didn’t get him.

    Don’t forget about the Nationals in all of this. They gave JAYSON WERTH a boat load of money…JAYSON WERTH.

  63. Darvish cannot be re-posted until next year. He wants to leave. Some rumours suggest that Hokkaido would really rather not have to pay that stratospheric salary, by NPB standards, next year. So… a less considered possibility is that AA also looks at sign-and-trade opportunities… More plausible than likely but it does point to some additional leverage AA could generate here.

  64. Besides, with AA going to Japan this summer, and showing great interest, Yu would have known that the chances of a Toronto winning bid were very good. Armed with that knowledge, he still decided to post to the bigs….

  65. I only think that because “blocking” dosen’t seem to be Alex’s style. He’s more concerned with the Jays than what others are doin. If in fact Rogers was big on Darvish, he had to be frugal at the winter meetings till this all sorted out. If there was no shot at Darvish, AA would have certainly been in on other things more heavily i suspect. His talk and and perceived frustration about payroll parameters last week was different for him.

  66. Darvish doesn’t really have the leverage to demand that he be traded elsewhere. One of the reasons that the posting system was instituted is to eliminate that type of player leverage after the Hideki Irabu/ San Diego Padres fiasco in the 90′s.

    Darvish’s options are to either sign with the winning team (hopefully that is the Blue Jays), or refuse to sign and return to Japan for a year (where he’ll make maybe $8M) and hope that his club agrees to post him again next November.

    In either case, he will not be playing in 2012 with an MLB team that did not submit the highest posting bid.

  67. Blasphemy. That song will forever be associated with Shawn Green.

  68. Blair brought up a point on his show yesterday that I agree with – AA values his time.  He felt that wouldn’t waste his time on this unless he felt that he had a chance to sign him.  To go through this process only to negotiate in bad faith is simply a waste of time.

  69. Besides, if you are a GM who loves trading and wheeling and dealing with other teams as Alex does, it would be stupid to get the reputation as a blocker. He has to have a good rep as a GM around the league and that would just ruin that.

  70. and in other news, this: ” In Silver’s model, teams projected to win 86 to 93 games are the best fit for nabbing a free agent of Fielder’s caliber”

    (from http://www.grantland.com/story

    so will you ‘status quo’ qq’ers just shut up finally.

    k, thanks.

  71. If he doesn’t sign this year I can’t see the point in him posting next year. Why not just wait 2 years and pocket the posting fee himself. Obviously no team will give him 50 mill to talk but you get my point.

  72. That is a very interesting point. Still… hard to value time over a 5WAR shift, even if that shift is one you are just preventing a competitor from getting.

  73. Disagree here… GMs are not children (and, as exec-level employees, are legally bound by fiduciary duty). AA is obligated to act in the best interests of the club. Another GM thinking he is a “blocker” will do nothing at all to his reputation compared to a single Team President thinking that this guy will not do whatever it takes.

  74. The idea of ¨blocking¨another team makes much more sense if you´ve only got 1 main competitor in your division, or whatever. This is the AL East, there´s too many good teams to try and manipulate.  

  75. if the bid blocks the Evil Empire, i am satisfied.

  76. It makes more direct sense, yes. But the real impact of being willing and able to block is probably the impact that knowledge will have on the overall bidding process. Other things equal, bids will be higher if there are potential “blockers” amongst the bidders than if it were a true blind purchase auction with all bidders intending to purchase. This may have lead some teams to expect the posting bid to generally be too high. Perhaps that explains why so many teams seem to have stayed completely out of the game despite Darvish’s reputation.

  77. I think if the Fighters reject the bid they can re-post him next year.  However, if Darvish is unable to come to an agreement with the bid-winning club, he can’t request to be posted again until his current contract expires in 2014.  Can anyone confirm whether I have this right.

  78. let’s get this tied off and then sign fielder. that happens and we’re really cooking next year. could you even imagine??? the skydome would be banging!!!! try to tell me that signing Darvish and Fielder wouldn’t put us in contention….maybe that was the whole ‘game’ all along. AA is sitting on his hands hoping that he can confirm Darvish before he knows whether it makes sense to go after Fielder this year. that makes sense to me. Fielder alone wouldn’t do it…but if he knows he’s got one of his missing pitching pieces…well…there just might be something to be said for going after the bat this year as well then……

  79. Would everybody just forget about Fielder already.  It is not going to happen.  Wouldn’t fit in AA’s MO because of the level of risk and lack of value.

  80. But does paying $50 million for the right to TALK to a starter that hasn’t pitched in the MLB match AA’s MO on risk and value either?

  81. I think it does, but you have to forget about the $50 million.  I assume AA considers that a sunk cost, the cost of doing business in this case, and will look for value relative to risk in the contract he offers Darvish.

    The other thing about the MO is that I think AA is more willing to keep going with what he’s got at 1B.

  82. oh I get that, and I’m one of those that full well accepts and is down with AA’s approach and MO. But let’s be clear – at some point, whenever he/rogers/etc decide that they’re going to make a ‘push’ he’s going to break the mold of his MO. it is indisputable. the question is really just a matter of ‘when’. I think there’s still an argument to be made for ‘not yet’…but then who knows. I was leaning much more towards the ‘not yet’ side until I heard the argument that rationalized that this is perhaps a rare opportunity for the Jays to pick up a free agent of this calabre without interference from Boston or NYY. So now I’m not so sure that AA wouldn’t drop a bomshell and be like ‘ok…we’re going to start the push’. because as much as anyone loves the approach/MO of AA, that will all go totally down the drain, and he will lose all confidence of the fanbase if it turns out they waste bautista.

    i swear to the almighty that will certainly be me. if they turn on the taps or make a push and it turns out it doesn’t line up with bautista and it fails? then seeeeeeeeee ya, i will curse them to my grave.

    that’s the thing. no fanbase is going to accept wasting bautista. they LOVE that story and it has sooooooooo much to do with renewed interest in the club. they absolutely cannot waste him….i would argue that the fanbase would more readily accept a trip to the playoffs and NOT winning the WS, than they would having to listen to some bullshit explanation that we’re still ‘on track’ where it becomes obvious we’re beyond bautista’s prime years…

    it COULD be 2013 or 2014 as they say….but it could be 2012. That’s a HUGE risk in my books. you don’t take a guy who can hit 40+ HR in a year lightly. you get your act together and make sure you can try something while you’ve got that as one of your chips.

  83. See I hope he never does come off his MO.  Time will tell whether he does or not.  I’m perfectly happy of having a pipeline of young players who may be better than the vet they’re replacing at the point the vet is moved and the kid steps in.  My understanding is that this is what AA is building, this is the MO, not to build up a deep reservoir of controllable talent only to blow the bank on a free agent with whom you are then stuck almost no matter the performance, or at least can’t get equal value back (the success being just being able to move the contract).

    As for wasting Bautista.  How about looking at it the other way?  What if they sign Fielder “for” Bautista, don’t make the playoffs this year, and Fielder loses his bat speed after next offseason and Bautista starts declining as well?  Then we’re really stuck.  The Jays are far better off attracting fans on a sustainable and ongoing basis, based on sustainable and ongoing success.  Besides, by the time Bautista is in decline, Lawrie will likely be the #3 hitter and the centre of all attention anyway.  Fans will forgive not signing Fielder this year for Bautista’s sake.

  84. Nationals have been confirmed out.

    Also – anyone notice that Bowden deleted his tweet?

  85. no one’s going to buy what they’re peddling if they’re still placing 3rd or 4th when lawrie’s the going game in town. you’ll have lost folks by that point.

    there is absolutely no rationalizing a way out of wasting bautista. the fans won’t accept it. either they make it to the playoffs while he’s still good or their approach/system just isn’t good enough and they should have made different decisions.

    no one is saying sell the farm. but you just can’t waste a HR hitter landing in your lap for an amazingly affordable price and a decently strong pitching lineup and outfield. there’s just no way you can rationalize wasting that.

    they started setting expectations and the bar last year. from this point on the fanbase is going to judge the ‘approach’ and the good sense of this system based on delivering returns. Cito’s 2010 team delivered 85 wins with a cobbled but promising roster. 81 wins last year. the expectation is that if the ‘system’ and ‘approach’ is working that there should be an improvement this year. and the next. if they were 10 wins short in 2010, it kinda goes without saying that there’s a reasonable expectation that they make the playoffs by 2012 or 2013.

    having a good ‘system’ does nothing for me, or the fanbase, if it just means they’re able to ‘replace’ a squad with an equally ‘just short’ squad….ie…so in 2014 or 2015 maybe you’re playing a lineup mostly of beede’s and d’arnaud’s and gose’s etc…but if you’ve also lost the best of romero and bautista…maybe your net result is still going to be 83-88 wins? not good enough. you have bautista and it would seem you ALREADY have lawrie. that kid looked pretty effin good already last year. you have Romero. you have escobar (i mean really…he’s doing what I think you would expect of him right?). so do it already.

    it is %100 unacceptable to waste bautista. *EVERYONE* wants it to happen with Bautista. that is the story that is wanted. Lawrie is great…but screw that. he’s got plenty of time to have his baseball story-as-told-through-faux-hockey-tinged-glasses-maple-dick saga.  Bautista is the name we wanna remember and the name we want to see up there associated with a pennant or better.

  86. No, no, the point is that they can win the division or wild card without Fielder this year or next and on an ongoing basis.

    The other point is that Fielder is not available at an affordable price.  He is not offering any sort of value and little flexibility once signed.  If the Jays are in the conversation as rumoured, I’m sure their intention is to offer no more than 5 years and less than $20 mil a year, which ain’t gonna do it, but it’s closer to fair value than what is being demanded and what the signing team will pay.

    All I was really trying to say was I’d heard enough about Fielder because it’s not going to happen no matter what happens with YU, not get into the relative pros and cons of signing him.  I agree that for 2012 at least Fielder would be a great addition to the line up.  But I printed out my previous comment so I can eat the paper it’s written on if I’m wrong and the Jays sign him.

  87. Interesting tidbit from Gregor Chisholm in the bluejays.com mailbag today.

    Contrary to what I previously believed, the Jays would gain nothing from TV rights in Japan.

  88. Jessica Simpson is yummy!!

  89. I can really picture Jose being really bent out of shape if someone else on that team makes more than he does

  90. Other than local ad, ticket sales, and maybe more for ads if they get improved ratings,  the Jays won’t gain much in additional revenue from Darvish. Merchandising and TV revenue is split equally among the 30 teams. The same happened with Dice-K and the Red Sox.

    Where the real pot of gold lies is in making the playoffs. The revenue from the additional games (most likely sell outs) is in the millions. If Darvish gets them a step closer to that goal, that’s where he’ll make his money for the Jays.

    Make the playoffs a couple of years in a row and the attendance boost usually carries on for years after. See numerous teams for examples. The Jays of the 80′s being one and the Indians of the late 90′s – early 00′s being another.

  91. Why? He signed his contract in good faith, knowing full well that if he had another great year he’d be underpaid. He chose the conservative end of the risk/reward spectrum when he signed the deal (where the Jays went the opposite on their end).

    He seems like a completely reasoonable person, and it would surprise me if he. Got ticked because the Jays paid someone more than him.

  92. I posted an article a couple days ago from 2008 about the Red Sox and the issues they were facing with regards to generating $$ off of Daisuke. Now, I can’t tell you if things have changed since 2008, and by all accounts, Darvish is more marketable/outgoing than Daisuke… But its not as extravagant as I also thought it would be.

  93. Good one…at least I know who the fucking impersonating loser is now haha. Get a life you fucking clown.

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