Welp, that’s it. It’s official. The Yu Darvish bidding has been won by the Texas Rangers.

It’s immensely disappointing, but we’ll have to give it some time to assess the damage and to figure out just what this means, how serious Rogers is about spending, where the club goes from here, and what other moves Alex Anthopoulos has up his sleeve. It’s back to the drawing board, but missing out on Darvish is hardly a make-or-break move for the franchise. It just… you know… kinda sucks. Plenty of time this winter for silver linings and apologetics. Right now, well… this…

Comments (467)

  1. Not saying we can’t compete within two years. Hell, if things go right and the players at the positions I mentioned earlier start to reach their potential, then a lot of good things could happen. It’s just that there’s so many questions right now. While the Jays have some good players they seem to be still a couple of years away from reaching their peaks or maybe they are lacking more than the one or two high impact players that they have now that you need to win a WS.

  2. AA probably should have said something to temper expectations until the reality was known. Regardless, this event has shown that DJF and Getting Blanked are kickass sources for baseball information. The rest of Toronto’s sports media got seriously pwned on this one. Well done Mr. Stoeten.

    Mike Wilner might have done fine if he didn’t argue with the mouth breathers so much.

  3. I agree i like our future but things could go wrong but high hopes for these prospects.
    Things could go wrong with signing high profile guys.
    If were going to follow a teams model, I’m all for following the Rays.

  4. Whoooaahhh…Drabek, a retread?

  5. Please, give it a rest with the ‘Jays should have KNOWN they’d need to bid over 51 million to win’ stuff..

    Nobody fucking knew.  There was actually a TON of speculation that the bidding might be quite a bit less than Dice-K.

  6. Just missed out on Latos?  I’m not interested in giving up 3 of our top prospects in order to get a pitcher with one good year, and one bad year on his resume while pitching in PETCO.  If that’s what we’re “missing out” on I’ll be glad.

  7. Absolutely sucks that the Jays lost the bid, but damn that’s going to be an expensive contract for the Rangers.  Do we really want $20-25M a year sunk on a single player?  Yu Darvish’s contract becomes a top ten financial commitment to a player in the MLB (More than the 20M Halladay is getting paid) and he hasn’t pitched an inning in the MLB.  It sucks, but we’ll get by.

  8. Dice K was overpriced, dipshit. In both the sense that the next highest bid was $40 million and that Dice K sucks. A bid of $40+ million is a solid bid.

  9. no.

  10. Rays are an aberration. I’m not willing to be horribly bad for a decade and hope I strike it rich with the prospect lottery. We’ve been waiting long enough. Current Rangers and old Jays model of the late 80′s the way to go imo.

  11. You are aware that our last GM did “get off his wallet” and spent very freely on the likes of Vernon Wells, Alex Rios, BJ Ryan, AJ Burnett, and Frank Thomas.  That got us an old roster, with basically no flexibility.  

    I’d much rather regret money not spent, than have those millstones back around our neck again.  

    Just “spending money” isnt the answer to anything.  That is exactly how you wind up like the Astros, or the Orioles.

    Have a little faith, Anthopolous hasnt really let us down yet.

  12. He’s not worth 51 million that’s why AA didnt bid that.
    But come on you have to assume that a player more talented is worth more money to other teams.
    If they really wanted him over 51. 3 or whatever Dice K got is what you would have to bid if you really wanted him.
    But who cares this guy could be a stud or a dud.
    Lets wait a couple of years. 

  13. Shouldn’t we just trade Jose?  If we arent getting Yu and we arent in on Fielder….and the available starters are going to deplete our prospect pool and are not good enough to put us over the top, shouldnt we unload this guy while his value is at an all time high?

  14. Dude I´m sick of these guys. They´re a bad smell that just won´t go away. There´s no magic here – there ain´t gonna be no Cinderella story.  That´s 40% of your rotation. Its time to fucking go….Lets see…. who´s next….Garza?  Beltran ?  Lets ee if we can fuck these up too

  15. Not sure why so many people insist Drabek is going to be the #5 starter out of spring training. He’d need to prove he can dominate at AAA before I trusted more starts to him at the major league level. Rather let guys like Hutchison or McGuire have a crack at that spot if we’re in for another year of rebuilding. Hell I’d even let the tubby ginger have another go first. At least he’s got a record of being successful in the AL East  on his resume.

  16. “Just missed out on Latos?  I’m not interested in giving up 3 of our top
    prospects in order to get a pitcher with one good year, and one bad year
    on his resume while pitching in PETCO.  If that’s what we’re “missing
    out” on I’ll be glad.”

    let me get this straight.. you don’t want to sign players that are free agent, you don’t want to give up prospects to boost up the team.

    hey, have a cookie, because you sure aren’t getting a team contending to the playff, much less the championship

  17. Again it doesnt matter if Dice K was worth 51 million to a team you have to assume Darvish is worth more.
    Come on Blue Jays fans were smarter then this.
    He just didnt feel Darvish was worth 51 million and he’s going to be right most likely.

  18. Do you even see “first reported” in stories anymore?  At this point everything becomes echoed so fast that its completely irrelevant.  

    The downside of being wrong, and completely ruining your career, massively outweighs the minute upside.

  19. They had no clue whether they had won the bidding til today.  The Jays are the victims over over zealous journalism.  Simple as that. 

    Assuming they put in a competitive offer, coming out with “damage control” would’ve looked so much worse.  

  20. Basically the rangers are the rays with money and had better postional players to trade.
    Sorry but we already sucked for ten years, I’ll take the rays last four.
    Rangers is a great model to follow.

  21. Just the opposite actually. There was a huge consensus that it would take big money. Some people actually said upwards of 70. It was universally accepted that he was better than Dice K and that the number would have to be commensurate to that. It was an elephant int he room – you´d have to be fucking comatose to not see it staring out at ya. 

  22. what a kick in the pants. Alright, time to sell the farm for garza and sign prince for 250 million dollars! FREAKOUT IN TORONTO!

  23. Seriously people — I’m sure AA valued Darvish and put in a bid he thought was appropriate and not a dollar more. 

    His MO is not to be irrational and to only make deals that make sense from a value stand point.  I’m sure he and his team came up with the valuation, after significant due diligence, they deemed was appropriate and bid accordingly. He takes calculated risks, but he does not overpay. 

    Have some faith and give the man some time to build  a winner.  I know it’s “Roger’s money” but irrational spending does not buy wins.  I want to see Rogers spend too — but I want them to spend prudently so we can have a competitive team with staying power.

  24. Altough Darvish could curse this team if they sign him, I like the Rangers so here’s hoping Darvish is a stud.

  25. Has Curling started yet?

  26. Yes the Ranger are the Rays with money but the Rangers are coming from the same place of mediocrity that the Jays came from (still at). The Jays-Rangers financial resources are much closer than the Rays-Jays resources therefore they make the more likely path for the Jays to follow.

  27. By that logic, with Dice-K being undoubtedly inferior to Darvish and his SECOND highest bid being $40 million, a bid of anything just over $40 million is not a solid bid.  

  28. Glad to see you losers get what’s coming to you. Probably the most angry, hateful, unlikeable group of morons on the entire internet. Enjoy fourth place for the rest of eternity chumps.

  29. Worth more than what? $51 million or Dice K? If you think Dice K was worth LESS than $51 million and you think everyone else thinks that as well, then how do you judge an over/under on the $51 million? It’s not clear as day. You know that economists study auctions, right? It’s not some basic thing you can figure out on the back of an envelope.

  30. I don’t understand why the Jays can’t take their $45 million and spend it on Oswalt, he only wants 3 years and is only 34. If you aren’t willing to go past 5 years on anyone you’re going to have to sign these types.

  31. I can come up with example after example of teams jumping the gun and “going for it” when they werent ready to do so, and setting their team back almost a decade.

    One that jumps to mind is the M’s trading Adam Jones, etc, for Eric Bedard.  Team flamed out, Bedard got hurt and they had nothing to show for it.  Slowly building is how you develop a consistent winner, look at the Braves, the Rangers, the Rays, the Phillies (ignore Lee and Halladay, its Hamels, Rollins, Utley, and Howard that are the core of that team).

    You know how the Leafs havent won a cup in 50 years, nor made the playoffs in close to a decade?  Its because they always take the knee jerk quick fix solution.  Yes going out and giving up d’Arnaud, Hutchinson and more for Latos might have panned out, but its also quite possible Hutchinson would be better than Latos anyway.  

    Trading prospects for win now talent isnt something I’m against, but it just has to be the right guys.

    That Latos deal was a huge win for the Reds.

  32. Are we fighting, I’m agreeing with you.

  33. I’ve never heard a woman call a guy a cunt.  Pretty much proves isabella is a dude.

  34. It’s fine logic on your part – but it’s incredibly easy to say that now that we know what the bid is (and have had a rough idea for a few days).

    Go look back through the speculation prior to the bidding deadline.  A lot of people thought it would be less than Dice-K because that has worked out so poorly for the BoSox.

    If money was no object, then yeah – they should have just bid 70 million.  But nobody knew exactly what the magic number to win this thing was.

  35. Totally, I’ll take Roy Oswalt for 3 years, over trading 3 top prospects for Latos.

  36. Again, if you think that everyone knows that $51 million was too much, and $40 million was probably too much for Dice K, why must the bids go way up instead of people saying “oh shit, maybe a better player is worth the same/slightly less/slightly more as what we bid for that shit-eater last time?”

    $40+ million is a good bid because Darvish is better than Dice K, and $40 million was WAY TOO MUCH

  37. For some reason I really hope the Jays bid 51.6 million and lost.

    Then Texas can be those asshole who bid one more dollar on the Price is Right.

  38. okay I’ve calmed down a bit now.  I apologize to AA, I am sure he has some balls, he just missed the boat on this one (probably just by a couple mill.), which really sucks, but I’m also sure we still care about winning.  AA has been very wise & very shrewd in all past dealings in sticking to his/their estimated player values (i.e. Prince, closers, etc.) – I just feel that in this particular case, Yu is worth over-bidding a little bit to secure his rights (even if we didn’t sign him), although who knows what rationale was used to come up with whatever # the jays bid.

    Maybe this too is a smart, shrewd move, time will tell, but I think Yu is the real deal, & would (have) INFUSE(d) this city & line-up with a snowballing energy & belief, that we are for real.  But it didn’t happen (this year).  Nothin’ else to do but lick our wounds, move on, & hopefully continue to make smart moves.  Garza is the next best thing, of what little I know about available pitchers, but Yu woulda been GREAT.

  39. I’ll take Danks, or Shields (if they’d deal in division) over Garza, but Garza over Gio.

  40. I’m REALLY concerned about Kevin Gray…has anyone heard from him? I fear the worst.

  41. Dice K wasnt worth 51 million but that is what he was worth to Boston.
    30 teams someone values Darvish for more then 51 million.
    Rangers did, if the blue Jays really wanted him, they would bid higer then Dice K just so they had a better chance at getting him.
    I knew he would ge tmore then Dice K, did I know which team know did I know if 51,7 was enough know I actually thought it would be between 55 and 60 million.
    Simply on the fact that he is younger, a bigger draw in Japan, he has star status, he makes over 6 million a year in japan palying baseball and 6 million with sponors I figured at least over 10 million  a year for his contract, tht brought me to 50 million posting and 50 million contract becuase I figured the ocntract and posting fee would be very close numbers wise and still do. Altough I figured over 10 million for him to even consider leaving Japan I figured he would get a five year contract worth 55, 60 million so that is why I felt the posting should at least be close to matching his contract that he would most likely be offered.
    I feel he is not worth 51 million, AA feels he’s not worth 51 million or he would have bid that, I gather you dont feel he’s worth tthat.
    But by all numbers being floated arounf almost every on that ocvers baseball thought he would ge tmore then Dice K.
    Because it’s a safer bid to bid higher then Dice K then it is to bid lower.
    If you really wanted him why hope you could get him for 45 if it’s a better shot at being the higher bidder with a bid over 51 million. 

  42. Yu are winner hahaha is now officially pissing me off.

  43.  never said 70 million but Imknew it would take more then dice K money.
    Everyone I heard thought the bid would be close to 51 million that dice k bid so if close is 45 million to 51 million why not ibd higher then the 51 million dice k got.

  44. Congrats to the Rangers.. im not at all pissed about this.

    In my opinion, the Jays need Fielder and now that we know they have the kind of dough to make it happen. SIGN FUCKING FIELDER!!! Imagine the numbers he and Bautista would put up back to back, imagine the pitches the rest of the line up would see as well.

    In the east either you win with BIG offense and mediocre pitching or you win with big pitching/bullpen and decent offense. The Yanks and Sox last year won with big offense and inconsistent pitching, the Rays were the opposite.

    I am NOT OK with a 10 yr deal however, I am ok with 6-7 years and 130-150 million dollars. I dont feel this would be bad for the team at all since I believe with inconsistent pitching in the AL East and aging NY and Sox teams, this could really make the Jays contenders.

    Think about this….

    Escobar – SS
    Rasmus – CF
    Bautista – RF
    Fielder – 1B
    Lawrie – 3B
    Thames – LF
    Lind/Encarnacion – DH (depending on the pitcher)
    Johnson – 2B
    Arencibia – C

    ** this line up would destroy things, lots of things, I dont care who’s
    on the mound, someone is getting to them at some point **

    Bench
    Valbuena
    Snider
    Mathis
    Davis
    Francisco
    etc

    ** Meh,, not bad…

    Romero
    Morrow
    Alvarez
    Drabek
    McGowan

    ** lots of IF’s here but if the IF’s happen, this rotation could be a lot better than mediocre **

    Santos
    Janssen
    Carreno
    Hoey
    Villanueva
    Litsch
    Cecil
    - perhaps a FA like Aardsma or a battle between prospects etc?

    ** looks a LOT better than the past few years. **

    All in all… thats a pretty damn good looking team. But if no Fielder… theyre wasting Bautista’s prime yet for yet another year.

  45. Thinking he;s worth less doesnt mean he gets less then Dice k.
    I could have been wrong but I also figured it would be kind of disrespectful to bid lower then what Dice K got for a better player.
    I’m glad we didnt get to talk to this kid for 51 million but it’s a safer bid to bid higher then the previous record that was Dice k.
    If he’s better, then every team had to know it was possiable he would get more then dic ek.
    No Dice K wasnt worth it, Darvish wont be worth it but it is a safer bid to bid higher then then Dice K.
    AA just didnt value him at 51 million and who can blaim him, he hasnt pitched an inning in the big leagues.

  46. Thats what TX thought, I´m sure of it. They bid 51.7.  Thats not coincidence

  47. I have more respect for Kevin Gray for actually coming out and owning that he made a mistake, rather than @insidethejays who’s just hiding behind a cover of anonymity.  

  48. We didn’t bid $52+ Mil because he wants 5/$75 Mil to play.  Alex valued Darvish less than $25 M/year.  

    Flexibility is still in place, and the farm is still crazy deep with some possible high ceiling guys very close to the bigs.

    Can’t wait to watch Rasmus, Lawrie, etc., develop this season.

  49. no god I type to damn fast, I dont have time to even know what I’m typeing.

  50. Also, Texas signed a tv deal for $3 billion over 20 years.  Effectively, their new payroll limitation is in line with the Yanks and Sox.  

  51. Alex Anthopoulos asking Nadir Mohamed for Yu Darvish posting fee:

    AA: Hello Mr. Mohamed, I’m interested in submitting a bid for Yu Darvish.
    NM: What?  Me a star fish?
    AA:  No, no.  Yu Darvish, a Japanese pitcher.
    NM: Alex, I’m a Rogers CEO, not a Japanese pitcher.  The holidays are stressful time of year, but I need you to stay focused.
    AA: True, but I’m talking about Yu Darvish.  A pitcher who can invigorate fan base like few have.  Don’t you remember sending me to Japan twice to scout Yu?
    NM:  Why would I send you to Japan to scout me?  I’ve never been to Japan.  Alex, I think
     you need some time off.
    AA: (sigh) Look, can I have 55 million dollars?
    NM:  What for?
    AA:  A very good Japanese pitcher who can make us a serious contender for years to come.  Not only that, but his marketability is through the roof.
    NM: Now I like the sounds of that.  Why didn’t you say that before instead of that star fish nonsense.  What’s the young man’s name?
    AA: Uh, we’ll just call him Mr. Darvish.  I think it will take 55 million to land his negotiating rights.
    NM: Negotiating rights? 
    AA: Yes, we have to pay for the rights to negotiate and then settle on a contract, I think 5 years 75 million will do it.
    NM: (Awkward silence) (several minutes later) That’s ridiculous.
    AA: Remember the marketing potential.
    NM: Hmmmmm.  I will give you 50 million and not a penny more.
    AA: But I don’t think it will be enough.  The fans are restless.
    NM:  Oh don’t be silly.  50 million will be plenty.  If there’s one thing I know, it’s the financial situation of the Japanese baseball circuit.
    AA: But….
    NM:  Merry Christmas, Alex.
    AA: Yes, Merry Christmas.

  52. what  a joke this was.  I love when wilner says that if you got your hopes up then you have no one to blame but yourself. really? this is  a guy who dedicates a whole show to darvish.  the fact is there is so much bad pr to come from this, alex should have managed expectations.  If he wasn’t making a high bid then all he had to do is call blair and tell him off the record we probably didn’t win. end of story.  why let the fanbase get worked up into a frenzy.  the jays have no clue about marketing.  but what do you expect from a team that had black unis?

    there’s a reason why the rangers have been to the world series twice recently. go big or go home

  53. I agree: at the time of the post for Dice K, Boston thought he was worth $51 million. Now, after going through that shit-show, people are not supposed to take that into account?
    You did not know that Darvish would get more than Dice K. In point of fact, for such a better player, with all of the things you listed, the winning bid is barely over $51.1. Your estimate was as much based on some industry speculation after the bids were in than any of your first grade algebra calculations. 

    If your only point is that “if you bid more, your chances to win go up” then congratulations, Captain Obvious. No shit. But why stop at 60 million? Why didn’t they bid 100? 

    Because it makes no sense to massively overpay for something you think you can win.

  54. Way to kill the joke. ;)

  55. Wilner has said he is ‘certain’ the Jays aren’t going after Fielder.

    Jays probably deal a bunch of prospects for Gio or Garza, then MAYBE are able to sign a guy like Beltran.

  56. Dude, if Matt Garza’s our second starter, that’s badass.

  57. jays should also build playing in the al west into their model.

  58. It’s true.  Signing Yu would have been WAY, WAY more fun than trading for Gio or Garza (or whoever they likely make a deal for)… but frankly, it’s not exactly out of the realm of possibility that either of those guys have better seasons than Yu does in 2012.  Yu looks amazing, and I would have loved for the Jays to have taken a chance on him, but it IS hard to know what to expect from him.

  59. why bother? that seems like a recipe for short and long term mediocrity…oh…you’re right that is the rogers blue jays baseball partnership way.

  60. fuck you Nolan Ryan

  61. Man, I know it’s only a few, but some here sound like they would’ve been real prizes as pissing, pouting three year olds. Ffs. I’m still trying to figure out how some moron tweeting or scribbling out of his ass somewhere becomes the team’s responsibility to manage one way or another. And if they didn’t know who actually won the silent auction ahead of time — and I’d wager they didn’t — how would they know what to say or hint at, exactly? And didn’t AA do that anyway? The ones who are mad that mommy and daddy didn’t get them the christmas toy that THEY WANTED, well … go to bed fer fucks sake. You’ll feel better in the morning. 

  62. Trading prospects for young, controllable starting pitchers is the recipe for mediocrity? Please provide examples of this.

  63. Again it’s a safer bid to bid higher then the previous record for a japanese player who is better then that former player.
    I didnt say a bid higher then 51 million would defetinly get you Darvish, but common snese told me some team would bid higher then Dice K just to be sure.
    Texas didnt value him at 51 million, but they bid 51.7 to at least know they had a better chance.
    If Toronto really wanted him, they would have bid higher then Dice K, hell if Dice K was 51.3 then Torotno’s bid could be 51.4 but it’s better logic if you really want the player to bid higher then Dice k.
    Rangers value him higher then AA, I laready said that, Rangers could have thought 49 was a good bid but because some team might bid higher then Dice K, simply because it’s realistic, they bid 51.7 a bid that they were happy with if they lost.
    AA didnt feel he was worth that mayb he bid 34 million.
    Who Knows but it’s common sense to think one of the 30 teasm will bid at higher then Dice K, just to make sure.
    If a team really wanted Darvish you almost have to pay him more then Dice K, jus tto make him happy, sports ego.
    AA has to sign players that make less then Jose, simply because of respect and ego.
    Detroit has never paid anyone more then Lidstrom sorry for the hockey to play in Detroit if you dont want to play for a lower slaray then our best player then dont sign here.
    We are agreeing on the fact that AA didnt feel Darvish was worth 51 million but if he really wanted him a safer bid is one higher then Dice K.
    I`m sure there was a team that bid 2 million just in case no one bid but because so many teams scouted him over dice K was a smart bid.
    If more teams were interested in Darvsih for 40 to 50 million mulitple teasm would have bid higher then Dice k simply because it` s safer.
    Of course he`s not worth 100 million he`s not worth 51 million, but settign a record for the best pitcher in Japan is a safer bid.
    If the Rangers thought 47 why not bid 5.7 more and if you lose it`s only 5 million more.
    It`s a safer bid then 47.
    How many times I use the word BECAUSE AND SAFER SHOULD TAKE A DRINK, STARTING NOW.

  64. the issue is not how much the jays bid.  it’s why the jays never give clear direction on what they plan on doing.  this no comment bullshit from alex is wearing thin. unless you know you’re going to win with a monster offer, then you have no choice but to tone down expectations.  It’s very easy to send signals off the record to the media.  I am sick and tired of hearing the jays are finalists on everyone.  if kenny ken ken and morosi said the jays are out we wouldn’t have gotten so worked up. thanks alex for nothing.

  65. Safer, I mean 4.7 million more.

  66. I’m frustrated this didn’t happen too – but Alex may not have known whether he won or not until today.  He did nothing to raise our expectations, and in fact lowered them with his ‘payroll parameter’ speech a couple weeks ago.

    If you’re going to blame anyone, blame reporters for passing rumors as stories, and blame us for believing sketchy sounding stories with no solid sources.

  67. Agreed, You cant comment on every rumor but this was one they should have broken policy for.
    If they made a large bid it would look bad to say we didnt get him and then get him.
    But people are going to be pissed, for ever silent assasin, they`re are silenter assasins look out AA.
    Like I said Darvish isnt worth 51 million to AA, but setting a record for the best pitcher to ever be posted is a safer bid. 

  68. I cant believe how much shit was made up this offseason.
    Especially with Darvish.
    Sports Journalists have just become TMZ.

  69. spending on “proven” players doesnt always work out either. read: vernon wells

  70. I know. We probably got too excited over sketchy rumors, but there really were some exciting things thrown our way.

    Two separate reports claiming (from seemingly respectable reporters) said we outbid the Rangers.  Reports of Rogers saying ‘get Darvish, whatever it takes’.

    Man.

  71. but that’s just the point, he didn’t win and the jays never win.  In the age of twitter you are going to have rumours and stories. would you rather have some blogger spread misinformation about your team or have it come from the horses mouth? the jays can easily control these rumours but refuse to so they end up going out of control every time.

  72. I like the moves AA has made so far, however, he needs to make this a pitching team or a hitting team as right now theyre still a 3rd or 4th place team.

    I want nothing to do with Gonzalez or the price attached to him, gonna have to do better than him to become a pitching team. The AL East is an offensive division, Fielder is the key now. We know the money is there, fucking do it.

    If he trades the farm for Gonzalez and doesnt pursue Fielder Im done giving a fuck.

  73. so let me get my facts straight, both alex and daniels were the only 2 gm’s to go to japan to scout darvish? and alex went twice? so all that to give a low ball offer. what a fucking joke.

  74. All of the teams simply tried their best to figure out what they think the other people might bid, and then raised their bid to balance the likelihood of winning with the possible extra cost. They did the trade off of increasing their likelihood of winning with increasing the costs. 

    Bidding over that value to be “safer” wouldn’t make sense if you think that, for the additional cost, the likelihood of winning doesn’t increase enough. 

    There is NO LOGICAL REASON to pin that value to $51.1 million. Darvish and Dice K are not the same pitchers, Dice K, with the benefit of hindsight, was clearly overpaid, etc. The only reason to bid the way anyone did was, for their valuation of Darvish, their bid balances the likelihood of winning with the cost of winning.

  75. Lowball?? You’re a Jays insider? You know what he bid?  Silent auction dummy. You bid what you think he’s worth to your organization. Go to sleep already.

  76. Dude, it could be worse.

    This is a good young team, going in the right direction, in a big upside market.  Depending on what AA does this offseason, it’s not impossible to think the team might play some meaningful September baseball in 2012 (especially with the extra WC).

    Lets see what AA does as a plan B before we jump off a bridge.

  77. colon, bartolo. bedard, erik. to name two

  78. I’d like to go from not impossible to probable.  There are too many holes in this lineup to be optimistic at this point: 1 reliable starter, no dh, weak in left, 1b, cf.  There is no plan B other than hoping the prospects turn into studs. It’s been 19 years of hope. Where has that gotten you?

  79. monte carlo projections suggest they have a 1 in 20 shot of making the playoffs.

    hey – they’re due!

  80. So because bad trades were made for Colon and Bedard, the Jays shouldn’t look to acquire a young starting pitcher in a trade?

    And instead should do something really sound like … signing a Japanese pitcher who’s never pitching in MLB for $125 million?

    I dunno man…I’m disappointed too, but AA’s strategy has been sound so far.

  81. Give me that stuff, that funk, that sweet, that funky stuff {Say what}

    Give it to me, give it to me
    Give it to me, give it to me
    Give me your stuff, that funk, that sweet, that funky stuff (Yo-ho, ow)

  82. Whatever.

  83. Now that’s tha shit!

  84. who are these ‘young controlable’ arms you think they should trade for, and at what cost? latos, the person i thought they should go after at the start of the offseason was traded. brett anderson is hurt, and likely always will be. there aren’t any other guys likely to be available that will translate to front of the rotation starters in the al east available via trade.

    aa’s strategy should be trading bautista before regression tanks his value next year, and fans realise how middling this squad is without an 8 win player on it.

    also: im not disappointed. i dont get my hopes up when it comes to robbers. they are cheap. we know this. they expect fans to drive spending while they make bucks hand over fist on all their other revenue streams outside ticket sales in the meantime.

  85. So it’s acquire Yu, or all is lost and trade Bautista?

    Acquiring Yu Darvish is not the only possible avenue to improve this team – even if it would have been REALLY fun.  It’s Dec 19, and the Jays have one of the deepest systems in the game.  I imagine AA will explore trading prospects for a #2/#3 type starter.  Garza, maybe?

    It’s an overreaction to pin all the hopes for the upcoming season on whether or not Yu Darvish was signed.  I think signing him would have been awesome, but he’s a total wildcard.  He’s not the only option for improvement.

  86. You people are sheep.  Sheep I say.  AA and Rogers have pulled on over on you all.  Look at all the hype and fan interest they created by simply pretending to “bid” money on a player they knew they would never get.  

    Think about it.  AA creates a shitstorm with this whole payroll parameters bullshit.  He needs a way out.  He decides the thing to do is to create the illusion that the team is strong into Darvish.  how?  by doing nothing really..just letting the big mouthed speculators blab away. 

    AA, full well knowing they will not win their bid, puts in any dollar amount he chooses up to 50 million.  He KNOWS this bid is a loser, yet he also knows that he now has collateral to go to the fans and claim “hey..we are serious here….we want to win now..come out and watch!”

    The truth is that he KNOWS a 49 million dollar bid is equal to a zero dollar bid..so there is really no “commitment” behind the gesture

    People need to realize that Rogers has alot of money…the jays dont.  Think about it this way….the jays are like a set of strict, rich, parents and the jays are a teenager.   Now it is true the parents have alot of cash.  But guess what, that doesn’t mean that Junior has alot of cash.  It just means that if the parents deem fit, they might throw junior a bone here.  Junior is under lock and key though and does not get to call the shots.  He might ask them for the keys to the Bentley, but they scough at him and tell him to go earn his own money and then buy his own bentley (like building up the farm and winning on the cheap..takes fucking years you know).

    I dont say this because I am not an AA fan.  I just realize the reality of the situation he is in. 

  87. you make so many assumptions. no, it’s add 10+ wins to the team this offseason, or trade bautista.

    they aren’t going to win in 2012 or 2013 with this team as is. bautista will be 34 in 2014 when alvarez will be more established, and MAYBE you have hutchison, or syndergaard or mcgwire or someone throwing at the back of the rotation. other than that – the team is what it is. maybe they trade for morales or something this offseason…but still, it’s not a team that’s leaping the 3 teams it plays in the al east for something like 1/3 of its games to win the division.
    the rays jsut added matt moore and a full seaosn of jennings. longoria didnt do anything until july.

    the jays are by far and away the 4th best team in the division…to say nothing of the league. all the ‘full season of lawire’ people need to take a reality pill and remember that bautista and romero had career years, and lawrie is going to get figured out by the league(as he already was being). also rasmus sucks. let’s just face it: he’s lazy and he’s not going to work to get better. that’s why he was traded.

    i don’t care about next year. that’s why i say: trade for the future. not for another year that they actually should be trying to ‘earn’ a higher and protected draft pick in the event they do sign a fa ever . ha.

  88. Maybe all of this ridiculous fan backlash will cause Rogers to spend this money elsewhere. That would be nice.

  89. “”you make so many assumptions”

    ” lawrie is going to get figured out by the league”
    “rasmus sucks. let’s just face it: he’s lazy and he’s not going to work to get better”
    “they aren’t going to win in 2012 or 2013 with this team as is”
    “it’s not a team that’s leaping the 3 teams it plays in the al east”

    I’m not making assumptions.  You are making assumptions.

    I think competing in the American League is going to be really tough, even with the extra WC.  I think it’s entirely possible that the Jays finish 4th in the AL East this year and don’t come close to competing.

    But I also see that the offseason is half over, and this team has plenty of prospects that could potentially be used to improve the current team.  Will that happen?  I don’t know. But it’s totally reasonable to consider it a possibility.

    If you also look back at the standings you see that a second WC would have taken about 90 wins most years.  With a couple realistic, shrewd additions do I think think it’s possible to approach that? Yes.  (Fuck, they won 85 two years ago). Not saying it’s going to happen or even likely, but absolutely possible.

    Point is – lets see what happens before writing everything off.  Game one of the regular season isn’t tomorrow.

  90. Lets just say…pure speculation – Jays trade prospects for Garza, sign Beltran, and beef up bullpen.  Would you be theoretically happy with that?  Or are you Fielder or bust?

  91. Why do you need to wait to see what happens when you know nothing is going to happen? what are you waiting for another mathis, rauch?

  92. I like Garza, depending who we give up. Beltran I do not like that idea. I’d like to see Garza and Fielder. 

  93. I agree rasmus is a lazy fuck. he looks like another alex rios.  I trashed that trade when it happened when the stoeten/parkes were calling it the heist of the century.  rios had that stupid hunched over stance and refused to change it.  rasmus has that stupid leg kick and refuses to change. now we’re seeing what larussa saw, a guy who’s not coachable and looks disinterested.

  94. “Why do you need to wait to see what happens when you know nothing is going to happen?”

    Great point.  Anthopolous has made no major moves as GM of the Blue Jays.  Just Mathis, Rauch type stuff.

  95. I like Garza too.  Would have loved Yu, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Garza had a better year at all (will have to give up a shitload of prospects though).

    I also like Beltran a lot.  He’s missed a lot of games, but his stats are still awfully strong:
    http://www.baseball-reference….

    I really think that could be a smart signing.  Looks on MLBTR that he might be going to St Louis though..

  96. He’s made no major moves that actually help the team win more games.  All wash trades and signing stiffs. Santos is the only clear thing he’s done that will benefit.

  97. Agreed. People really don’t know. I’d say from the rumours things were right….The Jays did bid high, even at 48MM..esp when you see other Japanese players only getting 2MM for their postings. The Sox and Dice K are the reasons why 50+ is even muttered. Overpaying to talk to these players is the reason why numbers are even thrown around. That being said, they didn’t and shouldn’t have bid what he was worth when the league and his team/Darvish himself were expecting more than Dice K numbers on the strength that they feel is HIS worth. So adding those 2 factors together the league and the Jays included had to bid what was respectable to Darvish and what their team could afford. NOT ONLY what they thought he was worth. If they did bid 48 i’d say thats really high to talk to someone, but also a bad bid because for some reason they anticipated nobody else was willing to bid as high as Dice K’s posting. Which was more of a gamble IMO.

  98. I don’t think it was a lowball offer, more of a gamble thinking the consensus was that nobody else was gonna let Dice K’s bid gauge what they thought was reasonable to bid on Darvish. Clearly they were wrong on that gamble. 

  99. “He’s made no major moves that actually help the team win more games”

    Gonzalez-Escobar, Marcum-Lawrie, dumping Wells, resigning Bautista, extending Romero, League-Morrow?

  100. Or do you mean this offseason?  It’s Dec 20, man!  He’s made one real move.  Make that call in March/April.

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