Alex Anthopoulos spoke to reporters today, ostensibly concerning the now-official signing of Darren Oliver. However, the conversation verged into other territories, and intrepid reporters like Mike Cormack of Sportsnet and John Lott of the National Post were kind enough to tweet along, keeping us plebs informed of what he was saying.

It was especially nice, because Anthopoulos had a couple of interesting things to pass along, specifically, the fact that he doesn’t “expect to do a whole lot more between now and spring training,” and that he absolutely loves Drew Hutchison.

“I’m probably as excited about him as I am about any of the young arms that we have,” the GM said of Hutchison– a right-hander who has pitched all of 15 innings above A-ball, but who Anthopoulos thinks is “coming fast” and will “play a factor” in 2012.

For a fan base who have watched their club fail to land the front-line starter they admitted they were seeking this off-season, it’s neither a great, nor an unexpected consolation. Not to disparage Hutchison or AA’s raves for him, but Matt Moore he ain’t. And even if he were, it’s virtually impossible to believe that he could be on the Opening Day roster, barring some unforeseen rash of injuries.

By all accounts he’s got a great future ahead of him, but he’s not the 2012 savior fans had been hoping for. And if Anthopoulos is to be believed– and there’s really no reason that he should be– it doesn’t appear that one is on the horizon.

Of course, things can change in an instant– and Anthopoulos admitted as much, saying that “as I sit here today I don’t see us doing anything else, but we’re still open to dialogue.” It’s also entirely not in the club’s interest for the GM to give up whatever leverage he may have and insist he’s determined to add another big piece no matter what it takes. But Anthopoulos is often a lot more truthful in these moments than those of us trying desperately to read him want to believe.

By this point in the process, you have to believe that every possible avenue has been explored, and so far it’s amounted to nothing. I’m not sure what might change that.

The market for starters may experience a bit of a re-set once someone locked in the Mexican standoff between the agents for Edwin Jackson, Roy Oswalt, Hiroki Kuroda and the clubs still looking for pitching finally blinks– which I suspect may hinge on the Commissioners’ decision on whether to expand the playoff field for the 2012 season, or to wait until 2013– but I’m not sure if that’s going to positively impact things for a club like the Jays, who will be hoping that the asking prices for Matt Garza or Gavin Floyd might come down. Perhaps if potential suitors sign a free agent and drop out they will, but I get the feeling the Cubs and White Sox aren’t any more desperate to move those two pitchers than the Jays are to move some of their prospects right this fucking minute.

Yes, there’s still a lot of movement that’s going to take place, and the Jays may well be involved. This may simply be a case of Anthopoulos posturing in order to reinforce what he’s been telling potential trade partners, and perhaps even talking up a prospect he wants to throw into a deal. But those kinds of Orwellian manoeuvrings sound a lot better in our fantasies, I think, and nobody should be shocked if Anthopoulos is, indeed more-or-less finished dealing.

Comments (161)

  1. AHHHH so he’s trading Hutchison!

  2. terrible offseason.

  3. I wouldn’t be shocked, but I would be disapointed.. well maybe not… maybe waiting till July to address your weakest link in the rotation is the way to go.

  4. At the current prices for front-line pitchers, you bet.

  5. Just about to say, remember how much they were talking up Nester Molina before Kenny Williams gave us Sergio Santos for him?

  6. My thoughts exactly!  Remember how we never heard all that much about Molina and then all of a sudden he was the greatest thing since sliced bread?  AA may not get what he wants in return, so Hutchison may not be traded.  But twice in two days we hear that kid’s name?  He is out there on the end of a line, being dangled in the water as we speak.

  7. I don’t blame Anthopoulos for not going after one of the reported “available” starting pitchers.  None of them make much sense, especially Garza and Edwin Jackson. 

    How anyone can be interested in Edwin Jackson (a guy that puts 1.5 batters on base per inning) is beyond me, let alone at $15 million a year.

  8. You give front offices far too little credit.

  9. If he’s saying the offseason is over, what he really means is that it is just getting underway. Fasten your seatbelts!

  10. AA’s waiting for the Rangers to sign Darvish – then he’s going to trade all his prospects to the Rangers for Yu. 

  11. Everyone clamouring for a blockbuster trade or big fat cheeseburger-stuffed free agent addition are moroooons.  They won’t put us over the top this year, and there’s no reason to rush the process to “appease the fan base”.  There are at least 5 solid pitching prospects coming who could very well turn out to be as good or better than the Garzas and Jacksons of the world.  If not, we need to give them one more year of development to make them major-league ready talent that we can and will trade for the bona fide ace or 5-tool fielder that will push us into perrenial playoff contention. 

    Everyone is saying that the Jays drafting abilities will be what puts us ahead of the competition in the new CBA world.  I disagree – it’s the development.  Look at how successful the Jays have been at developing mediocre talent / low round picks into major league prospects.   Watch – that will be the next area that organizations are beefing up to try to keep pace with the Jays.  Let them do what they do best, and continue to develop these guys!

  12. A rotation of Romero Morrow Alvarez Cecil and Drabek/McGowan isn’t that bad. It isn’t great, but it doesn’t make any sense to get a 3/4 guy because we will have 4 or 5 guys in our system that could fill those spots as soon as June.

  13. letting these kids develop won’t put “us” over the top this year, so i don’t see how your argument is any different than the one that suggests adding fielder MIGHT have more to do with 2013 and onward than it does with 2012.

    also worth noting:

    jays have no big bats close or coming.

    there are none on the market now or next year, asides from Josh Hamilton (actual injury risk)

    using the example of how JPR drafted low-upside, lower-risk of busting guys as being the model the jays are currently working in/with shows how out of touch you are.

    fielder is a vegetarian and that “cheesebuger” picture is from the onion (a satirical news source).

  14. I don’t see it happening and certainly not before the season starts. He’ll have potentially far more value after another season at AA. Low round draft picks like this guy and Matt Moore need time to establish their value because of all the doubters that look at ceiling before anything else. I wonder what the Jays would have got for Molina if hey had spent the entire season at AA and put up similar numbers.

  15. 4th place here we come!

  16. So basically, Antholpoulous is saying he could get us into the playoffs this season, but it would come at the cost of our sustained success in the future and it would be unlikely we could repeat the performance.  Thus, he chose sustained performance in the future, to the chagrin of the “win now” people.

  17. Re: the no big bats coming. With the wealth of pitching prospects coming up I think AA is keeping his options open, building up some more value in the young arms and will be looking to trade for a young bat if he needs to. Young pitching is always desired, AA seems most comfortable making trades. My guess is he has a few young position players targeted and will go hard after them when the pitching situation gets clarified.

  18. So who’s close (or even far away) to coming up to play 1B??  
    Not blowing his load on a slightly above average SP I can agree with, but to not even consider the ‘big fat cheeseburger-stuffed FA’ (tho to be fair, if you are in fact,  talking Prince then I doubt he is cheeseburger-stuffed as he is a vegetarian).

  19. At worst if Lind is a complete bust they could always move Lawrie to first, Bautista back to third and call up Gose to play center and shift Rasmus to right. There’s options for the next couple of years. It’s not ideal but it’s not the horrible situation people are making it out to be.

    There seems to be plenty of talent in the system at catcher, outfield, and pitching. Granted infield depth is pretty weak. Maybe that’s something AA corrects in this years coming draft.

  20. Patience is the key here. If the team performs there will be plenty of time to trade for someone like Garza mid-season at a lower price (less contract time left). If the team doesn’t perform, it’s not like Garza would have made that much of a difference.

  21. The Greek Geek is going to twurl a dandy of a trade, and he’s going to pop it like a Slap Chop real fucking quick.

  22. OK so they wanna see what they have internally for 2012. But what happens when the prospects don’t perform and we are a team that, once again, is left with too many question marks. How many years will these guys wait, and what happens when they realize that at some point they just might have to spend some scratch….

  23. iim curious to see what people where saying on here this time last year about Cecil and drabek….i would bet its a 180 from what’s being said a year later

  24. The offseason can’t be over because he still wants a bat and a number 2 in the rotation. The last time we were “done” for the offseason, Wells got traded…

    If the moves are done for this offseason though, I would be disappointed because the most important upgrade needed for the team was a number two starter and that hasn’t been met yet.

    Fuck the backup catcher, 5th outfielder, whatever role Frasor is, capital C closer and a nice (extravagent even?) lefty out of the pen! These are toys for Farrell to play with instead of what the team needs- which is a number two starter. Getting a number two starter basically puts the Jays in the race from day one. The Jays should be taking advantage that the Red Sox, Yankees and Rays have done nothing this offseason and get into the race.

  25. “The Jays should be taking advantage that the Red Sox, Yankees and Rays have done nothing this offseason and get into the race. ”

    Said this 2 weeks ago – fell on deaf ears.    

  26. That can’t be all she wrote for this offseason.  Has Rich Harden signed with anybody yet?  He will be cheap at around one year for maybe 1.5 mil.  I know the guy gets injured alot but AA wouldn’t have to take that much of a risk as far as money or length of contract.

  27. Well put.

  28. It is all good to say the Jays need a number 2 starter… But who would you suggest? I don’t see many avaialable other then Garza but they are asking for a Latos haul. Even though Latos is younger has 5 years of control (2016 FA) to 2 for Garza and is cheaper.

    I really don’t see one so why not wait till part way through the year when Seattle (Felix and or Pineda) or SanFran (Lincecum or Cain). Than 2013 offseason can be about pushing the team over the top. Heck they may even sneak into the WC 2 position with what they have.

  29. The Jays already have Dustin McGowan a high upside injury prone player. Why do they need two?

  30. To broach what someone else said recently, why are there only 2 possible scenarios ? 

  31. Good grief. You’re grooming Lawrie to be a 3rd basemen. You don’t bust your ass to find one, actually get him after two years to just move him to a position you can fill a zillion times easier (1B), not to mention, entering into the whole merry-go-round of shuffling Bautista around again. Or calling Gose up before he’s ready if you’re talking dumping Lind in ’12. 

  32. I don’t see how dropping 5-15 million on starting pitching would hurt us greatly in the future versus getting the team in a pennant race. The team doesn’t need to win the division- it just needs to be in a legitimate race to bring the fans back in the seats to bring in more dollars for the payroll i.e. being competitive.

  33. This has been said many times. I’m sure everyone is aware of this idea.

  34. |If you have to give up a couple prospects, and suffer substantially for it, then maybe the team isn’t as deep as is purported.

  35. They can get a number two the same way they got their big C closer. The front office is creative like that…  A player doesn’t have to be publicly available to pry them away.

  36. Agreed.  How does spending the money on Oswalt or Kuroda hurt the Jays ability to compete in the future?  Acquisitions via trade do however weaken our future as they usually involve high end prospects.

  37. Here’s what we can expect from the Greek Geek (love it) this year: NOTHING. Most overrated pile of stale spanakopita and watery tzadziki since Ambrosia. Just cashin’ in JP’s chips so far.  Here’s the thing: last year, we started with fucking Jo Jo Fucking Reyes in the rotation. Jo Jo Fucking Reyes, who went on to set the record for most starts without a win. Take a bow, AA.  This year? Our DH – again – is fucking Edwin Fuckin Encarnacion. Are you fucking serious?? A DH. A Designated HITTER. EE drove in 55 runs last year. You know who else drove is 55 runs last year (give or take a run?) COCO CRISP. MARCO SCUTARO, or as the Greeks might say, SCATARO. Oh yeah, EE, that’s our DH. WAIT! There’s hope … who else drove in 55 runs or so? YES!! Colby Rasmus!! HE who was worth Zep, Zach Stewart and a pile of other once worthy Jays. ALL PRAISE AA cos he’s funny, young, and Bob McCown makes Greek jokes with him. Meanwhile, the Sox, Yankees and Rays praise the turf he walks on, – YO – keep this dude in the chair another year or two!! 

  38. It blocks the Jays from finding out what McGowan, Hutchinson, McGuire and Drabek can bring to the table. So instead of finding out this year the Jays will have to wait another year delaying the progression. Not to mention why would a pitcher who is only interested in a one year deal in order to parley there value into a big contract sign in the AL East and not with the Yanks or Sox?

  39. oswalt and kuroda are 12mil plus for one year…oswalt is an injury concern and neither has pitched in the AL…i would rather take a flyer on harden and let everyone battle out for the starting positions….the two high priced free agents may not be anything more then a 4 starter on the jays……look how good Marcum was in the NL!

  40. i’m not going to waste the whole winter banging on about why fielder is a good fit now and here. you either think it to be true, or you don’t.

    i really don’t care what side someone takes.

    here’s the hard truth: the cba has changed the rules of the game. AA can’t just accrue picks and outspend in international free agents the other teams to build up a stash of trade bait. once he trades what is there…the jays will have to either outscout everyone (which most people believe to be a futile prusuit…hence the original moneyball dogma) or out-develop in minor league coaching (again, another sacred cow that is one of the cornerstones of mockery in these parts) through “teaching them the right way to play the game”…and since the Jays will likely continue to draft in the bottom half -to- bottom third of the league, they aren’t going to have reliable access to the can’t miss, sure-thing types that go in the top5.

    people seem to think that aa has some kind of magic wisdom about how he will find new ways to exploit the market, as if there aren’t 29 other GMs trying to do the same thing.

    i hope so, but, realistically, i’ll believe it when i see it.

  41. I didn’t realize JP got Escobar, Lawrie, Morrow, Rasmus for spare parts. Not to mention he dumped Wells’ contract. O yeah and turned the 30th ranked farm system into one of the top 5. Not bad in 2 years.

  42. I don’t think you’re valuing six years of control of the kind of elite young talent it would take to get a top pitcher enough. They are not easy to come by. And since you know that the attrition rate among prospects is very high, the fewer you hoard the less likely it is you’ll actually hit on the one or two who can make or break a franchise.

  43. Now top prospects and prospect depth will be even harder to acquire. Jays how one of the deepest systems in baseball and exploited the system till the last minute. The Jays will have 2 first round picks (not signing Beede and there own) plus one supplemental pick for each (Molina, Rauch, Fransisco) That is 5 picks before the second round starts.

    There will thus become a premium on young talent for teams like NYY, Boston, Cubs etc. Who had a nice system with Boras (increase your asking price so high that only Boston and NYY will touch you and we will make a killing).

    Because of the system depth, which is now at a higher premium the Jays will get more value for the prospects when they trade them to a rebuilding team. Thus he has now found the new market efficency.

    Not to mention rental players become a heck of a lot cheaper now that the 2 picks are no longer available to the team holding them. As well the Jays won’t have to give up a top pick to sign free agents for the most part going forward.

  44. Who mocks minor league coaching and player development?

    I think you’ve missed what’s targeted when we scoff.

  45. RBIs? Really?

    For the last 4 months of the season Edwin was a well above average DH. Please take your head out of your ass and go examine who is actually DHing for clubs these days.

  46. You make very good points. Personally I`m going to withhold judgement until the trade deadline. AA has made it clear a couple of times that he is targeting that period of time to pick up more pieces. Part of me really likes the idea because I think most the prospects will be worth far more with more playing time under their belts this coming season. However, the players that usually come available at the trade deadline are the opposite of those that he seems to target. Most of the players traded at the deadline are guys with a year or two at the most left on their contracts. If the Jays were further along in contending that might make sense but we haven`t reached that point yet imo. 

  47. David Ortiz would have been nice.

  48. either “teaching the right way to play ball” is a platitude, or it is a value statement about why certain teams are able to get more out of what are percieved to be ‘lesser’ players.

    which do you want it to be right now?

  49. The new dynamics come the trade deadline are going to be very, very interesting. I don`t think teams like the Yankees and Sox will have the advantages they once had when it comes to picking up pieces to fill holes that have emerged in their lineups.

    That said, teams that are on the periphery are going to have harder decisions to make when it comes to giving up those players that Yanks and Sox are interested in. If they keep them they don`t get the immediate benefit of prospects or other players in return  and they are also less likely to get any compensation if those players leave for free agency at the end of the year. The downside is that the weakened systems (a year or two out) of the Yanks and Sox won`t be able to offer up the potential returns they once did. That fact should also speak to the reluctance of teams like the Yankees to move their star prospects for mediocre players this past season and this winter.

  50. fielder is a vegetarian. rob ford is a vegetarian. i gotta stay away from those vegetables

  51. Reading between the lines, the Jays are going to go slow on Alvarez and McGowan so I don’t expect much more than 120-140 innings each. That means room for another starter. Ideally those two go strong until August and then someone gets called up for a look. But if one of the top 3 has early trouble (Cecil worries me), or one of bottom 2 does not pan out, the rotation is in big trouble. Which tells me the story that “we can compete this year” is a bit of a smokescreen. Even in the best case.

  52. french fries are a helluva food.

  53. Seriously.  The hype over Nestor Molina just prior to him being traded was no coincidence.

  54. i dunno, i thought the same thing back in the JPR days…wait and see…trust management. it’s sad that parkes chose to mock those that took a direct-action approach to influencing the company’s decision making process. it isn’t ‘cool’ to get involved. don’t dance at a concert, you’ll just look like a drunk. etc.

    it’s all silly if you remember for 1/2 a second that this is just entertainment, and that the maple leafs play in christie pits on sunday afternoons for free…or that there are plenty of diamonds around the city that you can play at yourself. but that’s a totally different story.

    i think that there’s a strong enough correlation between mlb payroll and wins that it’s easy for me to say: sign fielder. my job isn’t on the line. it isn’t an indicment of anything AA has done so far, or “the plan” (he never said there was a plan) or anything like that. it isn’t a demand to spend wrecklessly or on anybody that will sign here.

    it seems clear that fielder will go where he is offered the most money. the longer this goes into the offseason the more it seems that boras and fielder will have to come down from their demands.

    although he has lots of clients that sign after the new year, usually talks have heated up by this point.

    that they were in washington last week and not much has bubbled up since indicates to me, that even the Nats aren’t going as mental as they did last year to sign Werth. this isn’t a blank cheque being handed to fielder.

    anyway -i’m rambling. my point is, demanding fielder is less a condemnation of anything aa has done or is doing, than it is trying to help him make a case to the bosses as to why it would be worth forking out for him.

  55. Alvarez pitched about 160 innings last year between the minors and majors. The general idea is to not increase by any more than 30 innings, which would put him around 190. theres no reason to think hed be limited to fewer innings this year than last.

  56. I suppose I’m a little more optimistic. AA has shown himself to be incredibly clever, and he’s still young enough that it’s not like he’s settled into a set pattern and way of doing things. His relative newness to being a GM makes it probable that he can adapt, imo. My original point had little to do with Fielder or what I thought they should do, it was merely what I think they are doing. AA has shown a preference for trading, stated he’d prefer to trade midseason, has a lot of depth at premium positions, and going back I believe he stated that filling positions like 1B and DH are what he prefers to do last (easier to trade a CF or SP for a 1B, for instance)

  57. Rob Ford is a vegerarian? I didn’t realize beer, chicken wings and gravy were all made from vegetables… Ok, maybe beer is!

  58. Seriously.  The hype over Nestor Molina just prior to him being traded was no coincidence.

    The over exuberance for Nestor Molina came from one person. John Sickels. 

  59. If aa is done dealing then why is he still on the phone ?

  60. I’m still waiting for the Gavin Floyd newser. Lol

  61. And the Felix presser. And Cain.

  62. No I recall quite a lot coming out of the Jays organization, particularly AA and Sal Fasano.

  63. Jays need a #1 to compete in the AL east.  None are  available so why chase mediocure telent like Gio, Floyd or Garza.  we need a real difference maker ( think Felix or maybe Darvish) Garza is a decent #2 but we already have a great #2 and potential up the ying yang for 3-5.  AA couldn’t get what he wanted so he will wait until someone gets stupid or desperate and swoop in.  The only danger is that the yanks and sox will be back in the market soon.

    Lind sucks.  Sign fielder His contract length will be win now and later situation.  Think about ortis in his early 30′s.  Prince has tons of great baseball left at 1st and then DH,  tons.  Seriously Lind has slumped for 2 of the last 3 years, even if he gets hot early can you trust him to preform when you need him .  I would worry about his weak ass frame More than I would about fielder .  Lind is not an old man and is a professional Athlete so why the excuses.Its fucking 1st base all the big old guys play there.    He has had 2 years to get it back and has shown little consistency. Alas we will have a new first baseman and it will be ….David Cooper.

    and for the 18th time the theme is wait



    but at least now there maybe something worth waiting for

    come on spring, lets play some baseball

  64. Out of Lawrie and Bautista, Bautista would go to first. 

  65. That’s not totally true.  I remember John Farrell said that he thought Nestor Molina might be a closer candidate (for 2012!) a couple weeks before he was traded.

  66. There won’t be too much pressure on AA till after 2013. The hardcore fans will accept another year of rebuilding. AA will have to have a talk with Farrel who said the Jay could compete for the division in 2012.

    It is in AA’s best interests to keep expectations low.

    I suspect there will be one or 2 more moves to try and get a frontline starter.

    AA won’t overpay for a mediocre starter, so unless he gets a good deal he won’t bite.

    The Jays are currently on target for 80-85 wins.

    I was pleasantly surprised that AA DFA’d Teahan. He is learning from the ivera fiasco last year.

    The roster spot should be used for a young player to develop & not hope for a magical turnaround by Teahan.

  67. He did make that one remark, as apposed to Sickel’s who was pumping Molina’s tires since mid-season. Well, for the purposes of people saying the ‘Jays are trying to pump up their prospects value for impending trade’ sure, whatever. 

  68. Also was ranked behind D’anaurd on minor league balls prospect ranking. With a B+grade.

  69. lol sorry I meant Kevin Gray said he was a stud, and that his stuff is for real. My bad 

  70. Yip. I was aware. 

  71. Depends. Before Lawrie`s brief time last year, everyone would have claimed the opposite. We`ll see how his defense is over a full year. Personally, I think it will be fine.

  72. Agreed. Leave Lawrie at 3B. We haven’t had a gold glove 3B since Rolen, who had a great 2009.

    I think AA gives Lind 1 more year at 1B to figure out how to hit LHP & avoid 30 game slumps.

    Does AA make a move for Votto for 2013??? If the reds are sellers at the all star break, AA coud give the reds some pitching prospects & Lind & a maybe snider or thames.

  73. I would hope that the payroll parameters Rogers has imposed will allow for a pennant race in August.

    I have to take a second look a the schedule for 2012. The jays benefitted from a weak schedule in 2009 which gave us th magical 27-14 record.

  74. It will be interesting to see how the BIG 3 perform in 2012. It has been a quiet offseason for all 3 of them.

    At the very least the Jays should be closer to the Rays.

  75. Very funny rant. AA has till the end of 2013 to see if he can get above 88 wins.

  76. The only way you trade for Votto at the All-Star break is if you get to negotiate a long-term contract with him first. If not, just sign Fielder now. Even then, it`s entirely more cost effective to sign Fielder than trade high end prospects for Votto and pay him a comparable wage to what Fielder is going to make on top of that. The only thing you`d be saving is half a years wages.

  77. I`d say it would be a big failure if he`s not over 88 wins by the end of 2013. That really wouldn`t be acceptable imo. That would be year 5 completed of his rebuild and probably not enough wins to get into the playoffs. To me that would be no different than JPR`s 87 win season in 2006 nice but not nearly enough.

  78. This is realistic. JP Riccardi was able to sell moneyball approach to Rogers which in turn sold it to the fans. It is cost effective.

    AA has come up with the idea of investing resources in scouting, getting draft picks, better coaching etc. The minor league teams are winning which bodes well for the future.

    AA’s also takes advantage of other teams who get frustrated with young controllable talent.

    Look at Escobar, Rasmus & Lawrie& Morrow  are 4 solid core pieces he picked up frm other teams.

    Last year at this time, I thought Lawrie would be a distraction to the clubhouse & possible set fie to the stadium with his bad boy antics.

    Now, he is the “coolest” player on the team.

    AA will have 2 more years to try this approach & see what happens.

    A second wildcard should get the jays into playoff contention

  79. Agreed. Jays could have got him for 2 years at 25 million or so. Perfect protection for Bautista. Jays would be a sensation in the dominican republic.

    Ortiz hits well at Rogers Centre as well.

    Ortiz is an upgrade over Edwin.

  80. The key is to keep Edwin off the field in 2012. He seems to get rattled after a poor defensive showing and was much better as a DH exclusively.

    Will he outperform Ortiz in 2012?

    The only advantage is that he can play in the firld in emergency situations.

  81. I wonder if they will put McGowan on the DL in spring training to limit his innings?

    Cecil has to be better than last year.

  82. 2012 is a pivotal season for the Jays. If the kids come through & the vets perform to rational celings it will be a fun year.

    God forbid Bautista or Romero gets hurt. It will be a long season.

    I am chomping at the bit for spring training to begin.

    I want to see a healthy Morrow on the field.

    I wonder If Litsch will get a second shot at the rotation if McGowan or Cecil or Alvarez i snot  ready?

  83. I thought it was a done deal.

  84. LOL, how much more are we going to hear about sustained success in the future while the team continues to have one of the ten lowest payrolls in baseball?

    You have to be successful before you can sustain it and you can’t do the first one without spending at least $90-100 million on payroll.

    I can’t believe how “all in” people are on this hypothetical future success.

  85. I agree that you need a window to negotiatea long term contract  for Votto. You can’t give awy valuable prospects for 1 year of Votto.

    Votto is in better shape than Fielder, so he is worth more to the Jays.

  86. AA would be given credit by Rogers for getting 88 wins on a cheaper payroll adjusted for CDN dollars than JP Riccardi.

    JP spent 97 million us in 2008 when the cdn dollar was at par.

    If Rogers is generous & gives AA 97 million US in 2013 ,  he should be  able to get above 88 wins.?

    88 wins could be very close to the 5th wild card spot, which is a target for AA.

    As I have said before, Rogers executives must havebeen been furious with Riccardi for having to DFA BJ Ryan with a cheque for 15 million in july 2009

    BJ Ryan earned 47 million for 2.5 years of MLB service. Rios& Wells  became an albatross after 2008, etc.

    It is easier for Rogers to justify giving AA 10 million dollars to give 20 dominicans or cubans signing bonuses,  & have a couple turn out to be quality MLB players rather than blow the money on a free agent.

  87. The key is to try & keep most of the fan base excited about the young players on a low budget . Fans should tolerate AA’s plan until the end of 2013. If AA fails because the kids don’t perform to expectations or Bautista  demands a trade then they will find someone else to run the Jays.

    Rogers has a lot on its plate with MLSE & can focus on cross promotion etc…

    The problem I see is that Farrell thinks this team can win a division, & I don’t think AA wants to make that promise yet.
    AA must have a meeting with Farrell & demand that he lowers expectations.

  88. You can sell casual fans on the future success if you lay the young players. fans will forgive a poor performance by Snider or Thames more than if Juan Rivera or Teahan makes the same error.

  89. Yes everyone in the AL EAST is trying to keep up with the 4th best team in the divison of five.

  90. I love how your in the future crowd we’ll win can predict the future.
    Who’s to say we wont go another 20 years, It’s okay though becuse as long as they win down the road you’ll be right, even if it’s 100 years from now.
    Toronto Bluejays are the new Chicago Cubs, without the really trying to win part, at least the cubs took risks.
    Brutal Risks but there fans at least believe they want to win so they keep going to the ballpark. 

  91. 88 wins without a playoff spot after 5 complete years under AA is still a failure = to JPR`s tenure after 5 years. Payroll for 2006 was $71 million and got you 87 wins. AA`s payroll in 2013 will probably be higher by a good chunk if what he and Beeston says is true. Everything AA was supposed to do over those 5 years was supposed to build a winner that was built to last.

  92. I dopnt see how adding  aGarza and Fielder is a win now move, seeing how there younger then almost all of this team.
    AA said he wanted a number two starter and big bat, well that starter might not be there or the price might be wrong but that big bat is there all you have to do is throw money at it.
    No excuses this organization is a joke, we need a big bat, we wont go over six years, do they think there own players when it comes time to resign will take a discount, Beeston and AA are fucking space clowns.
    No trade claus, somepeople on here think this is the way to go, every other team so 29 teasm must be running there baseball organization wrong, stop drinkin gthe koolaid you avenue ass tools.

  93. Tony Lacava and the scouts turned the farm system around, Morrow has done shit, Lawrie was thanks to JP, Rasmus has been terrible, Reagins was a moron, Escobar is the only decent player AA had anything to do with.
    Taylor Ferguson = worlds biggest tool.

  94. Over?

  95. Correct me if I’m wrong but at this point last year we hadn’t signed Dotel or Rauch, signed Bautista to a 5(+1) year extension, traded Wells for Napoli and Rivera and flipped Napoli for Francisco.

  96. I am sorry is Lacava and the scouts not employed by AA? Doesn’t AA have final say on everything Lacava does? So obviously you are too dumb to understand a corporate structure. (Not to mention it was AA who beefed up the entire scouting department)

    Morrow has a fuck load more potential and talent then League. If you honestly think League is more valuable you need to pull your head out of your ass.

    Lawrie was from a trade of Marcum so if you are giving JP credit for drafting Marcum then sure, however AA made the trade to get him so yes that would be AA.

    Rasmus has been bad, in the month that he has played for the Jays. You obviously don’t understand what a representative sample means if that is your basis for argument. Look at his career and his age, numb nuts.  

    So Reagins is a moron what is your point? Doesn’t change the fact that, that was a great trade for the Jays. Props to Vernon for hitting .218 for 20M per and playing sub par defence!

    PS cool name calling at the end even though everything you wrote was wrong or were you sticking with the theme of your post?

  97. you are right, there are no big bats coming.  is d’arnaud a big bat?  regardless, pena is still available.  he’s a proven al east power hitter, 30 hr is easy.  if you can get him for 5 mil, same as lind, I don’t see how alex can turn that down.  it would be a travesty if he signs for that elsewhere.  there’s your dh/1b.

    fuck edwin.  yeah those crazy concepts like scoring runs and driving in runs have no place in today’s baseball.  you know why edwin only had 55 rbi’s?

    he came up 21 times with the bases loaded and drove in 9 (15% of runners)
    he came up 21 times with 1st and 3rd and drove in 4 (10%)
    he came up 30 times with runner on 3rd <2 out and drove in 11 with 3 sf

  98. wow look at the shitballers that the red sox keep signing!  this is going to be a hilarious season.

  99. Allow me to be the one to predict the future of the 2012 season. AA will do NOTHING big. NOTHING. At best, he will either trade for or sign more B+ players to one or two year contact while continuing to ensure fans that 2013 or 2014 will be “our year.” Meanwhile, he’ll tickle our balls and boost our curiosity with such asinine comments as “the Toronto Blue Jays Championship Season” yet continue to be out-performed and out-managed by the Red Sox, Yankees, and Rays.

    We WON’T sign Fielder because Rogers has AA by the balls and clearly does not give a shit about the team. Once Farrell’s contact expires in 2 years, it’ll be back to Boston for him and we’ll come round full circle. Maybe we’ll give Gibbons another go like we we did Gaston.

    Drink the kool-aide, kids. “Just be patient…… We got all the young and unproven ‘talent.’ Just get your friends to come this year and maybe, JUST MAYBE, we’ll sign MANNY RAMIREZ!! Would you like that!?!”


  100. why the fuck is farrell even managing this team? if you’re not going to spend money then just give the job to sal fasano and pay him 500k.

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