Warning: apc_store(): Potential cache slam averted for key 'w3tc_blogs.thescore.com_15_object_69be6f0f58698dc437fd681ecbdd920c' in /opt/blogs/wp-content/plugins/w3-total-cache/lib/W3/Cache/Apc.php on line 41 The Pay is the Thing: Anthopoulos Speaks… To Us! | Drunk Jays Fans | Blogs | theScore.com

Ahhhh, to think back on more quaint, innocent times here in Jaysland… like last Thursday! That was the day, long before any of this week’s unfortunateness, when the Jays were kind enough to let our very own Drew Fairservice sit down with Alex Anthopoulos for a wide-ranging interview that you can see in full over at Getting Blanked.

Obviously it would serve no purpose for me to reprint here what you can simply click the link above to see (seriously, do it), but what I can do is pick out the most interesting, eyebrow-raising segments and explode them all like so many small homophobic-slur-written-on-eye-black-in-a-different-language controversies… er… or something. And naturally, the main topic in an Anthopoulos interview that any fan is going to skip to regards payroll, and what we can expect to see there going forward. So let’s focus on that.

When we do so, we see that, unfortunately, at times, somewhat like his predecessor, I’m starting to get the sense that Alex actively wants to distance himself from the question. Granted, any of what appears to be a newfound appreciation for opening up on the subject may be due to the fact that, as he explains near the end of the conversation, “with more time spent in the job, it is natural that you get more comfortable in your own skin. At the same time, you get to know your own media so well and build relationships. You can let your guard down at times.”

With the conversation coming on the heels of last week’s minuscule-by-comparison flap surrounding Carlos Villanueva, perhaps that’s what Anthopoulos was addressing here, though he certainly didn’t do so directly.

“To be honest with you,” he says, “I get sick of having to be so guarded. It is exhausting. I know it is important to stay consistent but it is exhausting. Sometimes you want to feel like you’re just talking to your buddy over a beer and just have a conversation but the unfortunate part is you just can’t be like that in this job.”

At the same time– and presumably as part of feeling more comfortable in his own skin, and with the media in the city– he understands how completely pointless some of the guardedness can be.

“If someone is hitting .180 with 5 home runs and he’s playing every day — we don’t have this right now — but I say this person’s not guaranteed a job, I’m stating the obvious,” he explains.

It’s at least somewhat through this prism, I think, that his deliberate clarity about payroll needs to be viewed. All that understood, it’s not like he’s said anything terribly new here, rather, he continued to reiterate the not-too-outlandish idea that fans simply need to be “realistic” about their expectations when it comes to payroll– because, y’know, I totally seem to recall that it damn near bankrupted Rogers when the Jays ran a $75-million USD payroll a decade ago, worth $100-million now adjusted for inflation, while the Canadian dollar was worth about 63 cents, right?

Asked about last month’s deal between the Red Sox and Dodgers potentially being a model for future deals, he explained that “it is not so much a willingness to make a deal like that– everyone wants to make the club better. It is more about what’s realistic, what do you have to work with? Sometimes you just have to accept it.

“What the Dodgers and Yankees can do is different than what other teams can do. Rather than cry about it and stick your head in the sand, you don’t worry about it and you deal with what you have and you work with it. Our payroll is not top 5 but I think it is a solid payroll to have. There is room to go up but it isn’t going to go up for the sake of going up.”

Clarifying further– by which I mean making clear that he isn’t the one personally setting payroll, and therefore perhaps further implying that he’s not satisfied with where it’s at either– he explained that “sometimes it is viewed that the GM doesn’t want to do this or ownership doesn’t want to do this, it is not that black and white.”

“It is a balancing act,” he explains. “I told the media the other day: I have an area that I’m asked to stay around. In the right circumstances, that is where my conversation with Paul comes in. I’ll sit in his office and I’ll say ‘there’s a chance to get so-and-so and this is how it will impact payroll’ so there is dialogue about it.”

That said, this is a GM who doesn’t fear that money will not be there when he needs it, particularly for homegrown players. Edwin Encarnacion’s deal this season is a prime example, he explains, suggesting that last winter the club decided to wait on exploring an extension for Edwin, despite considering the possibility, due to Encarnacion’s strong second half of 2011, the spike in his walk rate, and– presumably, though unstated– the low cost.

However, ”sometimes it can be more damaging to do it too early and tie up your payroll versatility,” he says,  not referencing anyone in particular *COUGH* Adam Lind *COUGH*. “We could have done this earlier but if we were wrong it is not only the money, you almost lock in the position on the field. If you start making too many of these mistakes you can’t hide everyone on the bench.”

And then the old refrain: “Paul always says he doesn’t mind waiting. He says ‘we will back up the truck’ when it is time.”

And how much could potentially be in that truck? Well… it’s not Alex’s job to know.

“I know what you’re saying, all our games are on Sportsnet/Rogers owns Sportsnet – it’s like the YES thing for the Yankees,” he says when asked about the shiny new cable deals that are powering spending around the league. “I’m never involved in those discussions and those meetings, it’s all way above me.”

“I know it is not what everybody wants to hear, but it is the truth,” Anthopoulos says at one point, summing up the entire conversation quite well. “It is a combination of things. Our payroll has gone up and everyone expects it to be significantly greater than it is, but it isn’t in a bad area.”

Sigh.

I mean… it’s not bad news by any stretch, it’s just… sigh.

Comments (126)

  1. Not exactly a huge boost to my confidence level hearing that. Then again I am not surprised because Rogers history with the payroll or more accurately the total money for all of the baseball operations has been average to below average for the majority of their ownership. Even when you add in the extra spending on scouting and amateur spending it’s not as much as you think relative to other teams. If Jayson Stark at ESPN was correct in his assertion that the Jays did in fact get revenue sharing then that money is slowly disappearing as well and people will have to factor that in to the equation. I’ve rarely, if ever, heard it mentioned by local media but it’s not an insubstantial amount.

    • They got revenue sharing before, and don’t now. This has been mentioned.

      • As I understand it it wasn’t all cut off at once. It’s clawed back 25% a year from what I read in the CBA. If Stark’s figure of roughly $36 million is accurate they’ll be down $18 million in 2013.

        Of course I might have missed where they came out and stated they don’t get revenue sharing at all now. Do you have a link that I could read for my own education?

        • Nope. Gonna have to Google it. It may well be getting clawed back, as you say. Same difference, really.

          • It’s still a decent sized hole on the revenue side of the equation. $18 million would get you a pretty decent starter and something else this coming winter.

      • Rogers can’t fool the MLB anymore. Will AA be forced to keep payroll steady to account for the loss of 30 million in revenue sharing?

  2. The sad thing is he didn’t even say anything. I’ve been behind what AA has done with the Jays so far, but I need a sign of good faith this off season. The second half of the season, particularly the last week has been such a shit show, I’m not sure what direction this team is heading.

    • It’s been a bad second half. That’s about it.

    • There certainly is just as many questions to worry about going into the winter compared to last winter. Sure we had some of them answered on guys like Cecil but got a whole bunch more on guys like Romero. The injuries to the pitching only make things worse because without significant additions you’re starting the season with Morrow, Romero, Alvarez and Happ which is pretty awful even if Romero bounces back. Of course I’m not saying AA isn’t going to fix things but there’s still plenty to worry about.

      • The question marks are different this year. The ones from last year have been pretty well been answered or they are moot.

        • I think that’s what I said. Some being answered and a whole bunch more on guys like Romero lol

          • But it was the important ones that were answered.
            And there will always be question marks with the roster.You never reach perfection.
            remember when The philly’s ahd the best pitching staffs EVER in the history of baseball?
            Or Boston had the best team EVER in history?
            Both teams had question marks.

          • The decline of Romero this year is very worrisome.

      • It’s not really as awful as you think.

        • Do you anticipate it being harder to attract free agents this year due to the way the season is winding down. I guess I’m asking if the Jays have credibility issues going into the off season.

        • That’s far too simplistic a statement. It IS bad right now; the questions that have arisen are largely the same areas as last offseason but have grown in importance/trouble.

          Here were the key issues the team was managing last offseason:
          LF – who will step up and will the production be sufficient; now, the issue is – will a rookie (Gose, Sierra) be enlisted for full time duty and how short of league average production may the produce? Who could we acquire outside the organization instead?
          SP – Liklihood of Alvarez, Drabek and Hutchison/Cecil filling in 3-5; now the questions are Romero’s liklihood of bounceback, Alvarez ability moving forward, what is status of Los Del V in offseason and who filles 4/5 (Happ as likely for 1 of these). There are a TONNE of pitching questions here
          1B – we asked likelihood of Lind’s bounce back; now the question is who can plan 1b/DH given another failed season from Lind.

          These are all huge questions, none remedied by this past season.
          2B

  3. Maybe it’s just the end of the season don’t-give-a-fucks, but I find it hard to look deep into what AA says these days. I think the message has been pretty clear of late, and it’s a matter of waiting to see what he comes up with in the winter. I appreciate your effort in panning the wordy silt for shiny nuggets. I just think the next real news AA makes will be in the form of a player transaction, I’m all worded out.

    • It’s put up or shut up for AA. It’s cognitive dissonance for him to pretend that he doesn’t know the FMV of broadcast revenue & the resources allocated to payroll.

      He’s still afraid to call out Rogers for lack of resources. Don’t blame him. He has kids to feed

      • I think its just street up denial, not this:

        http://psychology.about.com/od/cognitivepsychology/f/dissonance.htm

      • “He’s still afraid to call out Rogers for lack of resources.”

        So he should publicly state what we all know, that Rogers are cheap fucks, possibly lose his job and you would feel better about all this.

        I’d like to thank the DJF community for calling you out Oakville for the idiot that he is.

        The worst part is he isn’t even trolling.

        • Lol. I think Rogers would get more respect from fans and media if they were honest about refusing to build a team with free agents. They should stop pretending that the money will be there in some mythical year. They should have the guts to say that they only believe in I ternstional options and farm system as a way to build a team. Or trades as long as they don’t add too much to payroll.

          I said AA won’t call out Rogers because he needs to keep his job.

          The attack on AA from Gregg zaun was devastating.

  4. I wish someone would put the exchange rate question. I seem to remember that when the US dollar was strong, we often heard the ‘we have to pay salary in US’ excuse trundled out. And rightly so, it was a big problem.

    Right now, the fundamental economic landscape for Canadian major league teams has changed because of the strong Canadian dollar – that’s in essence behind why NHL teams are suddenly economical again in smaller Canadian cities. In light of that, it’s kind of disingenuous to say ‘the payroll has gone up’, as AA has said often recently. The predominantly Canadian income is now worth at least 33% more (and I think that’s conservative) than it was in 2008, while the US salary expenses have stayed contstant.

    You’d kind of like Rogers to recognise that and take advantage of it while it lasts, while also recognising that television ratings, television rights payments from ESPN et al, and even attendance have all been performing much better in recent years that they did at about the same point a decade ago.

    • Problem is, that’s a question for Beeston, who is only going to give you a mouthful of shit, regardless of what’s asked.

    • They more than likely have had hedging programs in place to even out the fluctuations in the currency for years now.

      As for things in terms of real dollars or present day dollars, the payroll in 2012 certainly looks worse relative to the league when you factor in currency rates and inflation. Of course you can’t look at it in absolute terms alone. Context has to play a large part and the last two years of rebuilding weigh heavily on payroll being lower than normal. Going forward that context of rebuilding becomes less meaningful.

      • No actually they more than likely don’t. You don’t understand what hedging means. Rogers is not some trading firm. If they want to buy a billion US dollars they can do it anytime.

        • Hey Dr.

          Pretty well all companies have hedging programs in place when they deal with foreign currencies for large parts of their operations. The Jays certainly have used them in the past.

          BTW go fuck yourself first then go look up what hedging means yourself. Then go download the Rogers A/R and search for the word hedging. It came up 13 times.

          Here’s a couple of examples

          Foreign Currency Forward Contracts
          In July 2011, we entered into an aggregate U.S. $720 million of foreign currency forward contracts to hedge the foreign exchange risk on certain forecast expenditures (“Expenditure Derivatives”). The Expenditure Derivatives fix the exchange rate on an aggregate U.S.$20 million per month of our forecast expenditures at an average exchange rate of Cdn $0.9643/U.S. $1 from August 2011 through July 2014. As at December 31, 2011, U.S. $620 million of these Expenditure Derivatives remain outstanding, all of which qualify for and have
          been designated as hedges for accounting purposes.

          Economic Hedge Analysis
          For the purposes of our discussion on the hedged portion of long-term debt, we have used non-GAAP measures in that we include all Debt Derivatives hedging our U.S. dollar-denominated debt, whether or not they qualify as hedges for accounting purposes, since all such Debt
          Derivatives are used for risk-management purposes only and are designated as hedges of specific debt instruments for economic
          purposes. As a result, the Canadian dollar equivalent of our U.S. dollardenominated
          long-term debt illustrated in the table below reflects the contracted foreign exchange rate for all of our Debt Derivatives regardless of qualifications for accounting purposes as a hedge.

          • Are you really this stupid. You claim the blue jays are a large part of the rogers organization?

            Of course they may have hedges for OTHER parts of their company. That is why you see the 720 million. Do you really think that 720 is all for the jays? You think the jays are billion dollar company?

            I believe paul beeston said they buy US dollars at the beginning of the season and that’s it.

            Like I said don’t talk about something you know nothing about.

          • And I also believe it says at the bottom that hedging was used for US dollar debt not for jays payroll.

          • Wow you must have taken an extra dose of your dumb pills today and maybe one of the moron ones as well. If you look at the original post I was responding to he mentioned Rogers. As they are the ones that ultimately control the money, they were the ones I was talking about.

            Even better, your very own example, yes your own, of Beeston buying US dollars at the beginning of the year is the definition of hedging. See the second link – page 3. The key point is they made a forward purchase. Now go the fuck back and look at the definition of hedging one more time. There’s more than enough references out there with regards to the Jays hedging go find the rest yourself.

            http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/business/story.html?id=fc2466c9-dd93-4d9b-8fcf-8a8fbef36a07

            http://www.imanet.org/PDFs/Public/MAQ/2011_q3/MAQ_summer_2011_rivera.pdf

            http://blogs.thescore.com/mlb/2011/12/14/the-toronto-racist-money-hoarders/

          • Wow you must have taken an extra dose of your dumb pills today and maybe one of the moron ones as well. If you look at the original post I was responding to he mentioned Rogers. As they are the ones that ultimately control the money, they were the ones I was talking about.

            Even better, your very own example, yes your own, of Beeston buying US dollars at the beginning of the year is the definition of hedging. See the link – page 3. The key point is they made a forward purchase. Now go the fuck back and look at the definition of hedging one more time. There’s more than enough references out there with regards to the Jays hedging, go find the rest yourself. Guys like Godfrey have mentioned it numerous times. The fact of the matter is that pretty well all businesses do it when dealing in multiple currencies. Considering the Jays primary costs are in US Dollars it’s only logical (to all except you) that they would hedge their exposure. Sure when the dollar is closer to parity they’re likely going to reduce the amount of hedging they do but it doesn’t mean it’s not taking place.

            http://www.imanet.org/PDFs/Public/MAQ/2011_q3/MAQ_summer_2011_rivera.pdf

          • Holy shit, buying us dollars is not hedging. How the fuck do you expect them to pay payroll if they have no US dollars? As I said you have no idea what a hedge is? Hedging is buying futures contracts for long term exposure not day to day operations.

            Wow you are actually referring to what the jays did in 1984 to now? That is ridiculous.

            Ok genius show me the link where the jays are hedging right now otherwise shut the fuck up.

          • You are a complete and total idiot. Hedging covers a variety of different processes as can be explained here.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Exchange_Hedge

            It’s more than just buying US dollars as they need them tool. The purpose of buying large amounts of US dollars in excess of your immediate needs and locking that purchase into a particular price is to protect yourself from fluctuations in the price to the downside. They do that through various means like currencies futures or derivatives and it’s a form of hedging.

            If the Canadian dollar were to suddenly tank then the Jays US Dollar costs go up which would be bad for the club. For example, locking a large purchase of US dollars in at par now protects them in the years to come if the US Dollar were to surge again on a strengthening economy. There’s dangers of course to that because if it goes the other way being locked in means you lose. To mitigate that risk they do a whole raft of other things which is where it gets really complex and why it’s probably done at the corporate level.

            I never mentioned any particular timing especially currently but I referred to what was going on likely for years when the Canadian dollar was in the shitter and I showed examples of that.

            I can even write you out a twinkie analogy for cross border shoppers if the rest is too complicated for you to understand.

            I really do wonder about your reading comprehension. No one, least of all me mentioned day-to-day operations.

            Once again to use your own example Beeston knows that Jays operations will cost say $75 million in US dollars for the coming year. The US dollar vs the CDN dollar is fluctuating all over the place. His pet bean counters will tell him that things for the CDN dollar are going to do one of three things, Get worse, stay the same or get better. Say they’re going to get worse for the foreseeable future, then the bean counters will tell Beeston to buy as many US dollars now as the risk warrants.

            Lo and behold 6 months down the road the CDN dollar has declined 25% vs the US Dollar. The US Dollars Beeston bought back then in bulk are worth 25% more because they took a risk and hedged their currency exposure ahead of time.

          • Listen you dipshit, don’t try to explain to me what a hedge is since you are the clueless one.. You think the cdn dollar is going to crash? There is not even 1 analyst out there who thinks that so why the fuck do you think the jays would need to protect that? That makes you a fucking idiot.

            The jays don’t have this significant risk that you claim will bankrupt them if the dollar falls.

            The jays have to buy US dollars every year to pay payroll. That is not hedging you fucking fool. That doesn’t protect them from any long term risk. I’m tired of having to explain basic concepts to you.

            Since you are so fucking ignorant let me explain to you that lots of companies STOP hedging when there is little risk of downside.

            http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/story/2003/11/21/barrick211103.html

          • Hard to believe you’re that dumb but you continue to amaze. It’s likely done at the corporate level or at the very least it’s reported that way in the AR since they don’t break out the Jays numbers.

            I know the downside of hedging idiot as it’s the exact opposite of the benefits of doing it in the first place. You also hedge in times of relative strength to avoid paying more in times of weakness moron. That’s how Barrick got burned eventually because they continued to hedge long into a bull market for gold. What the article doesn’t say was how successful Barrick’s hedging program was in the years prior to golds rise. Their probably wasn’t a Barrick AR I didn’t read all through the 90s.

            The very fact that Rogers has foreign currency forward contracts to the tune of $720 million shows they do it more often than idiots like you realize. Once again put on your comprehension hat and go back and read the section I posted from AR. And yes moron the $720 million is obviously not all for the Jays. It’s not the Jays AR idiot. You don’t think Rogers has other US Dollar expenses beyond the Jays? Remember they own other media outlets whose content is largely created in the US. Did you see the $20 million US figure a month they mentioned? That’s a good place to start.

            Here’s the quote one more time, please read it carefully or have a grown up explain it to you.

            “In July 2011, we entered into an aggregate U.S. $720 million of foreign currency forward contracts to hedge the foreign exchange risk on certain forecast expenditures.”

            See the last 3 words? CERTAIN FORECAST EXPENDITURES. Might cover things like payroll eh? Idiot.

            Considering where the dollar is now, their hedging program doesn’t look like it’s saving them all much as the dollar is above what they hedged at but it’s not costing them a ton either at this point. The point is they are covered until 2014 if the dollar does tank.

            Whether it’s profitable for them now or at other times was never the issue. The fact of the matter is they do it now, and they did it then, in spite of your ridiculous assertions otherwise.

            Also I never said they’d be bankrupt if they didn’t hedge. Honestly, that’s about the third or fourth time you’ve tried to put words in my mouth. Then again I don’t suppose you can help yourself as you had trouble comprehending the response to the original post in the first place.

            I can’t possibly hope to make it any clearer to show where you went off the rails. Try again though it’s amusing. The fact is the Jays have hedged in the past and Rogers certainly hedges now. End of story, game over, you lose, please come again.

          • I’m done explaining this to you. Now you’ve twisted your argument. first you said the jays were hedging their payroll. Now you say it’s rogers when it’s clearly for their other divisions which has nothing to do with the jays but you claim that you are still right.

            And I’ll try to explain it once again. Hedging worked for barrick when gold was weak, it didn’t work when gold was strong which is why they stopped doing it. The jays hedged in 1984 when cdn dollar was weak. Well guess what dipshit, the cdn dollar is strong now so take a wild guess what would happen if they started hedging now?

            “the fact of the matter is they do it now”

            you haven’t shown one bit of proof to show the jays do it. You’ve only shown rogers does it for other divisions and somehow claim that you are right.

            Beeston has already stated the jays don’t hedge yet somehow I should believe you instead. now fuck off.

          • Oh and you keep harping on the 720 mil. Well lets see the jays payroll is 70 mil so that would hedge them for the next 10 years? Are you fucking insane?

            Or else since you are the resident expert please tell me how much of that was for the jays? 7 mil? so then what the fuck was the other 713 mil for?

            It should be obvious to anyone but you that if you are hedging close to a billion dollars they must have some other major risk they are hedging not the jays.

          • It’s also nice how you didn’t read the bottom of your post where it clearly states the hedging was for long term US debt. But of course that must be jays to you.

          • Duh of course it worked for Barrick when gold was weak. Since they sell gold they were operating in a state of relative weakness and they were protecting themselves from gold dropping further as it did all through most of the 90′s which is why they hedged. I said that. It’s also the same reason they lost money when the price of gold went up because their contracts were worth less the than the rising price of gold. The same applies to Rogers or the Jays. Again I know you’re a fucking complete moron but hedging works both ways. They will hedge whenever they feel the CDN dollar will go down vs the US dollar. That could be in periods of relative CDN dollar strength or weakness. As long as it goes down vs the US dollar they save money. Again since they can’t always be right they do other things to mitigate that risk through derivatives.

            Since the CDN dollar is strong now it makes sense to buy US dollars when the going is good not when the CDN dollar is dropping the Rogers brain trust did that very thing in 2011 as stated in the AR. I know you like to gloss over things you don’t understand or fit your BS narrative but it’s there in black in white. . Holy fuck it’s not a hard principle to understand.

            Since the Jays don’t break out any of their financial numbers you know I can’t link exact details. The fact that their corporate parent does it and the Jays under previous ownership did it in the past not to mention other Canadian sports teams that pay salaries in US dollars is all you need to know. If you want to be purposefully obtuse then all the power to you. It certainly suits your arguments because you’re losing this one badly.

            Last time numbnuts the $720 million isn’t all for the Jays. Again if you read the passage it was for August 2011 to July 2014 or 36 months. 36 months x $20 million is OH WILL WONDERS NEVER CEASE? $720 million. Got that? Need to take off your shoes perhaps to help you do the math? Finally I know you keep completely missing this but Rogers does do other business where their costs are in US dollars. So no fuck face, for the last time $720 million isn’t all for the Jays and it isn’t for one year. If you actually took the time to read things before jumping to erroneous conclusions you wouldn’t appear nearly as dumb as you are and would have seen the figure is for 3 years not one.

            Again take a look at what else Rogers does and maybe just maybe you’ll figure out they’re a rather large media company that has to pay for content.

            $240 million per year minus things like the Jays payroll and other US based costs like scouting and amateur signings probably leaves $140 million. Hardly a ton when it comes to buying US created content.

            The fact is Rogers hedged $720 million in July 2011 for 3 years. The fact is they Jays under ownership prior to being purchased by Rogers did it. I’m right, you’re wrong end of story.

            Owned. Thank you, please come again.

          • Idiot the debt is also hedged and it’s a completely separate thing you noticed the amounts are different didn’t you?

            Here is the pertinent paragraph. Have you ever read an AR before?

            INTEREST RATE AND FOREIGN EXCHANGE MANAGEMENT

            Foreign Currency Forward Contracts

            In July 2011, we entered into an aggregate U.S. $720 million of foreign currency forward contracts to hedge the foreign exchange risk on certain forecast expenditures (“Expenditure Derivatives”). The Expenditure Derivatives fix the exchange rate on an aggregate U.S. $20 million per month of our forecast expenditures at an average exchange rate of Cdn $0.9643/U.S. $1 from August 2011 through July 2014. As at December 31, 2011, U.S. $620 million of these Expenditure Derivatives remain outstanding, all of which qualify for and have
            been designated as hedges for accounting purposes.

            Again CERTAIN FORECAST EXPENDITURES

            LOL you are high entertainment I will give you that.

          • Wow nice how you refuse to answer the question. 240 for 1 year when the jays payroll is 70 mil. Yet I’m just supposed to take your word for it that it was for the jays based on no evidence.

            And you just showed what a complete moron you are by saying “hedging works both ways”. NO IT DOESN’T. If you hedged and the cdn dollar rose you would lose money.

            And somehow you think rogers are currency traders that know if and when the dollar will rise or fall. Even the best traders are wrong half the time yet you think rogers is smart enough to know?

            hey enough of this shit. If you want to delude yourself into thinking rogers is making millions off of hedging and somehow that money will be plowed back into payroll good for you. You are a sucker.

          • Again CERTAIN FORECAST EXPENDITURES

            oh I get it now. I completely missed where it said blue jays payroll. Stupid of me. Thanks for clearing it up.

            240 mil for a 70 mil payroll got it.

          • I explained it to you multiple times. The $240 million covers the entire corporation. Yes it’s hard for you, I get that, but the Jays are part of the corporation. They’re the ones that ultimately paying the Jays bills.

            Where did I say they were making millions being currency traders? The fact is they hedge to protect themselves. End of story. It’s a way to mitigate risk. You’d know that if you actually understood what a hedge was which you’ve failed to demonstrate this entire thread. I even admitted as things stand with the CDN dollar now they’ve lost a little on that hedge. Keep trying to add points if you think that helps your cause because you’re just making a complete fool of yourself.

            As for coming out and saying Blue Jay payroll, there’s 3 references to the word payroll in the entire AR idiot. The don’t break down the Jays numbers that way as I explained to you multiple times. Are you sure your name isn’t Multiple Miggs? You sure need things explained to a lot. If this was a few hundred years ago you’d be one of these idiots claiming the earth was still flat because you hadn’t seen otherwise for yourself first hand. Bravo! What a mind you have.

            Where did I say they were plowing anything back into the Jays payroll? Oh that’s right, I didn’t. Hey I know, maybe you’re arguing with your invisible friend at the same time. Please do us all a favour and put your tinfoil hat back, take your meds and and stop listening to the voices for a while.

          • “BTW go fuck yourself first then go look up what hedging means yourself. Then go download the Rogers A/R and search for the word hedging. It came up 13 times.”

            Classic. It’s exchanges like this that make me read these comments. Nice work, manimal.

          • Protect themselves against WHAT??????? What risk???

            You think rogers is worried about some collapse in the cdn dollar?

            Please explain to me why american barrick is NOT hedging while the jays ARE hedging genius? In case you didn’t know, barrick has a lot more than 100 mil at risk.

          • “I even admitted as things stand with the CDN dollar now they’ve lost a little on that hedge”

            Holy shit, you’ve now completely contradicted yourself.

            First you said the jays hedge to even out currency fluctuations and to mitigate risk but now you claim they are losing money on it? So how the fuck did they mitigate the risk if they LOST MONEY??? They obviously didn’t.

            This is exactly why I explained to you why they don’t hedge, because you can just as easily lose money on the deal (just like barrick). Thanks for proving my point.

          • Dr. RW…it is obvious that you have goldfish turds for brains. Your ADD obviously kicked in numerous times, based on the constant butchering that you were doing wrt to n_m’s analogies and examples.

          • Look I’m sorry I don’t have time to give you a complete education on business right now. I doubt that it would help anyway since you can’t even grasp the purpose of currency hedging for corporations.

            There’s always inherent risk in any business venture. Pick up a prospectus or AR and there’s whole sections dedicated to risk. Even though the risk doesn’t seem like a big one to you, the bean counters thought otherwise. I’m going to side with them over you any day.

            A quick example would be the dollar dropping from $0.96 to $0.90. That’s at touch over 6 per cent. If the dollar stays there for the next couple of years that 6% of $720 million is $43 million. That’s a relatively small amount but every penny is important to corporations. Bean counters would sell their own mothers for lesser savings.

            As for contradicting myself I did nothing of the sort. All I said was they hedge to mitigate risk. I was completely honest in telling you that as of right now they lost a little on that hedging just like Barrick did with their hedge program before it was completely unwound a few years ago. I not going to defend their decisions one way or another but it doesn’t change the fact that they hedge over long periods of time to even out the short-term fluctuations that nobody can predict or control. On average they protected themselves from the dollar dropping below $0.96 according to the AR.

            You keep denying they’re hedging but that’s your problem. It’s right there in black and white in their very legal AR that they do in fact do so.

            As for Barrick they also currently hedge but just not gold. Here’s a blurb from their AR on page 51

            “Our shareholders want full exposure to changes in the gold price, and consequently all of our future gold production is unhedged. Our corporate treasury function implements hedging strategies on an opportunistic basis to protect us from downside price risk on our copper production. We also actively hedge foreign exchange risk for key input commodities such as fuel. Please see
            pages 56–58 of this MD&A for a description of our
            exposures and mitigation strategies for these risks.”

            Then on page 56 there is this:

            “Fluctuations in the US dollar increase the volatility of our costs reported in US dollars, subject to protection that we have put in place through our currency hedging program.”

            The point is, and at this stage it’s become rather dull one beating it against that head of dense stone you have, the vast majority of corporations that have significant costs in foreign currencies hedge in one way or another. Yes Jimmy it’s true after all.

            Really actually take the time and download Barrick’s 2011 AR and read pages 56-58. They seem to do a much better job at explaining what they are doing than Rogers does. They even have fancy line graphs and tables that might be easier for you to understand.

            Are you sure you’re not a red headed step child?

          • ok so let’s get this straight. If the dollar dropped from 96 to 90 they protected themselves from a 6% loss or 43 million right? But if the dollar increased to 1.10 then they actually would lose 14% or 100 million.

            So how was that mitigating risk again? If that happened then that so called genius hedger you like would be fired immediately.

            No actually it says that rogers hedges. It does not say that the blue jays hedge. You see you just made that up like pretty much everything you say.

            As for barrick the link I gave was clearly referring to gold but hey keep changing the subject to prove your point. I pointed out to you that a billion dollar gold company doesn’t hedge because it sees LITTLE RISK IN GOLD FALLING. Just like the jays wouldn’t hedge because there is little risk in the cdn dollar falling. Is this too difficult a concept for your pea brain to grasp.

            And you keep saying rogers has significant currency risks? REally? A 10 bill company is worried about 40 mil in currency fluctuations?

            I suggest you read the barrick report since you have no understanding of anything business related. I’ve tried to help you but you are alost cause. good luck.

          • Yes obviously they are worried enough to do it just like Jays did under previous ownership and Rogers and Barrick are doing now. Again it’s a common corporate practice. Too big of a concept for you to understand obviously. Like other risk protections put in place by corporations it doesn’t always work out. That’s just the way it is. You even provided one example with Barrick on a hedge that backfired. Now you’re saying nobody else would do it. Christ airlines do it with their gas all the time. It’s a very common practice, nuff said.

            Keep ignoring what’s right in front of you. I told you I can’t show you exact items for the Jays because they don’t break the numbers out. As a result of that you can’t confirm they don’t either. At least I can show that their corporate parent that pays the bills does hedge. You can’t show shit except for how dumb you are.

            As for Barrick, yes in fact they do hedge, just not on their gold. Whether that’s what you were talking about or not is irrelevant since we were talking about currency hedging here. They’ve always done it and didn’t stop even when they did with the gold. You’ve tried to change the subject multiple times and add other points along the way with little to show for your evasions.

            You popped off with some comment about Rogers not hedging and buying a billion US dollars anytime they want. I’ve shown you it doesn’t work that way. I pointed you right to the very page where Rogers themselves said they hedge their currency exposure. You tried to ignore it in the hopes that if you plugged your ears and screamed loudly enough that it might actually not be true. Well sorry Jimmy it’s a fact.

          • One more item for you from the AR on hedging which just might make things a little clearer. Then again who am I kidding right? lol

            “On initial designation of a derivative instrument as a hedging instrument, the Company formally documents the relationship between the hedging instrument and hedged item, including the risk management objectives and strategy in undertaking the hedge transaction and the
            hedged risk, together with the methods that will be used to assess the effectiveness of the hedging relationship. The Company makes an assessment, both at the inception of
            the hedge relationship as well as on an ongoing basis, of whether the hedging instruments are expected to be highly effective in offsetting the changes in the fair value or cash flows of the respective hedged items attributable to the
            hedged risk, and whether the actual results of each hedge are within a range of 80 to 125 percent.”

            So there you go. Their hedged contracts are monitored on an ongoing basis. They likely have other derivative instruments to protect their hedges.

            http://www.ehow.com/info_8611069_derivative-hedging-instruments.html

            The pertinent quote from that link is this:

            “A successful hedge involves a derivative instrument that provides almost identical value changes in the opposite direction compared to the item being hedged. As such, you offset any risk of losses but also remove any possibility of profiting from price fluctuations. If the hedge is ineffective, you may suffer a loss or earn a profit from the hedged item. However, the effective hedge would still minimize your loss.”

            That’s it Jimmy, school is out for the day. Go home and read a book.

          • I wasn’t going to respond but I then I realized you must have been lying in your first quote from rogers financials so I thought I’d check and low and behold you were.

            It clearly states page 114, the paragraph before your quote:

            “The company uses derivative financial instruments to manage its risks from fluctuations in foreign exchange and interest rates associated with it’s US dollar denominated DEBT INSTRUMENTS…All such agreements are used for risk management purposes only and are designated as a hedge of specific DEBT INSTRUMENTS for economic purposes.”

            The whole ‘table below’ lists all the “DEBT DERIVATIVES”. That whole fucking section you quoted was referrring to long term debt. The remaining 600 mil was clearly listed in the table as a “debt derivative”. But hey keep lying to prove your point.

            The “certain forecasted expenditures” you keep referring to are DEBT REPAYMENTS you idiot.

            The fact that you wasted all this time quoting something from the debt section and using it for jays payroll shows what a complete moron you are. I feel sorry for you. This is obviously way over your head. You don’t even know what debt means. You lose. I’m done with this. Now go back to playing with blocks.

          • LMAO!!!! Ok ok I knew you were dumb and totally ignorant where this stuff was concerned but it just goes to show you know absolutely nothing about what you’re talking about.

            You make my own point for me once again by quoting exactly what they are using the derivative for but you’re so stupid you don’t even understand what you’re saying. I think that’s the funniest part so far.

            Let me try and explain to you what a derivative is in the first place knucklehead and so you can understand why it’s under debt.

            Ok hopefully we can agree upon the fact that they hedged $720 million dollars. Hopefully we can agree upon the fact they used derivatives to manage the risk for that $720 million dollars as I stated above. Keeping up so far? Probably not but try extra hard.

            Remember here’s the quote from above:
            “A successful hedge involves a derivative instrument that provides almost identical value changes in the opposite direction compared to the item being hedged.”

            So basically what they’ve done is they’ve taken out a loan or insurance in form of a Derivative on the money they planned to hedge thereby protecting themselves from the value fluctuating too much. That loan or insurance is considered a liability while they are being covered because it’s a cost. Got that fucktard? It’s accounting 101. It falls under the debt side of the equation because the hedge runs for 3 years. They are paying for protection on the underlying asset of $720 million. I can’t make it any clearer than that for you.

            If you weren’t such a giant idiot you’d notice that in the table discussing the Derivatives used to cover their hedge on foreign currency forward contracts cost them a grand total of $2 million or just more than a single Jeff Mathis or roughly 0.27% on that $720 million.

            Now pay attention Jimmy I’m going to show you something else.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Derivative_%28finance%29

            Again the pertinent quote is:

            “Derivatives can be used for speculation (“bets”) or to HEDGE (“INSURANCE”). For example, a speculator may sell deep in-the-money naked calls on a stock, expecting the stock price to plummet, but exposing himself to potentially unlimited losses. VERY COMMONLY, COMPANIES BUY CURRENCY FORWARDS IN ORDER TO LIMIT LOSSES DUE TO FLUCTUATIONS IN THE EXCHANGE RATE OF TWO CURRENCIES.”

            There you go moron. I can’t spell it out an more clearly than for you. They took a chunk of cash bought US Dollars and then took out insurance in the form of a Derivative to protect themselves against the fluctuations over the next 3 years. . IT DOESN’T GET ANY CLEARER THAN THAT. THEY ARE OBLIGATED TO PAY FOR THAT INSURANCE OVER THE LIFE OF THE CONTRACT.

            A little later on in the article there is this quote:

            “2. The derivatives market RELOCATES RISK from the people who PREFER RISK AVERSION to the people who have an appetite for risk.”

            That’s what it all comes to down to JImmy relocating risk on their foreign currency bought ahead of time.

            The hedge is backed up by Derivatives.
            Derivatives are insurance in this case.
            Insurance is a cost.
            Costs go on the Liability side of the balance sheet.

            Please now you should really stop while you’re miles behind. Even I’m starting to get embarrassed for you now. As much fun as it is to completely expose you for the loud mouthed moron you are, it’s starting to take on the appearance of clubbing baby seals.

            If I have to continue to educate you I’m going to have to send you a bill.

    • Very good point. This was brought up a few days ago when we compared Rogers payroll in 2001 when the USD dollar was 1.6 CDN.

      Rogers spending 70 million USD in 2001 was equal to 112 million CDN which is much higher than the 83 million USD they are spending now.

      The broadcast& gate revenues are inCDN.

  5. What I don’t get is if alex is so worried about budget constrainsts then why does he keep wasting money on stiffs like mathis, dustin, rajai etc. Why not pool that money and get a legit player in fill in the backup roles with scrubs and AAA players like gomes, sierra, d’arnaud.

    • Because you have to pay somebody to fill out those roles, those deals barely nudge payroll, and there’s obviously value in having players develop at their own pace, not throwing them unprepared into the MLB fire.

      • There are lots of scrubs available who can’t get jobs like dewayne wise, jayson nix etc who will sign for cheap. There’s no need to be grossly overpaying shitheads like rajai and ben franscisco.

        • 5mil on cordero does a lot more than nudge.

          • Look at Coco’s stats before this season.
            And where is Coco now.
            And for a team that wrote Teahen’s 5 mil just to aquire a player…
            5 mil doesn’t hinder the Jays.

    • Because the stiffs are expendable and cheap.Literally placeholders until much better players become available.

    • Pretty sure Mathis and Davis are not a waste of money assuming they’re part time players, and not full time as has been the case this year.

  6. AA says that there’s no point in looking at what the Dodgers are doing or the Yankees are doing because it’s not realistic to expect the Jays to do that. Which? OK. I understand not backing the truck up every five minutes. However I have to point out what everyone on this board knows and that is that Rogers are the wealthiest corporate owners in MLB and possibly the wealthiest owners right across the board. With a very lucrative tv angle as well. This is not some poor guy who owns a team and is doing the best he can with the money he has. They are very happy to play in the AL East with the big guys because it means tons of lovely attendance revenue when the Yankees and Sox come to town. Which is frequently. No doubt they would point to the Rays as a very successful franchise that has gone far with little money, but the Rays tanked for years and years to do that. What happens when they run out of top draft picks and have to rely on money to pay for the team? Running a low payroll in the AL East won’t hurt Rogers, who will make tons of lovely money anyway. But it will hurt Toronto Blue Jays fans who are sick of listening to a string of reasons why money cannot be spent. The overpriced contracts occurred in 2005 for Ryan and Burnett, 2006 for Wells and 2007 for Rios. That is a long time ago and one would hope that the club has now earned the right to pay some serious money for decent players. That does not mean that I want them to prance down to the winter meetings brandishing blank cheques all over the place. But it does mean that I will not accept either bad money paid in the long-ago past, or attendance as an excuse for deliberately underfunding the club.

    • Sadly the Jays are only ever going to be treated as a division within the greater corporate entity and that’s going to limit them from really ever tapping the rest of the Rogers cash flow especially as long as it’s beneficial for them to hide as much revenue from MLB as possible among their other divisions. Liberty Media does the same thing with the Atlanta Braves. Corporate ownership certainly can have it’s advantages but it certainly has it”s downside as well.

      I do agree with you on the stigma of the Ryan, Burnett and Wells contracts though. Just because they necessarily didn’t work out as expected doesn’t mean they should be avoided at all costs in the future. The contracts weren’t done in a vacuum.

      • @NM
        But that division provides content for other divisions.as long as the Jays provide interest.The Ryan,Burnett,Wells contracts were an impedament to moving forward.
        Even Boston did a salary dump to give them flexablity.
        With revenue sharing disappearing,revenue will be derivired through other streams.

        • Yes at that particular time they might have not worked out. I believe Isabel was referring to people saying “yeah well those contracts bombed that time so don’t even think about similar ones in the future”. There’s reasons why those contracts weren’t necessarily great investments at the time and we’ve talked about a lot of them before, mainly that adding them to a foundation that wasn’t there wasn’t the smartest thing to do. Rogers had cut back on amateur spending and scouting significantly prior to that weakening the foundation.

          As for the Jays providing content to other divisions, that’s my point. The revenue is being hidden in those other divisions and corporate is not looking at is as Jays revenue even though we all see it that way. I’ve argued the point many times in past and it pisses me off to no end but it doesn’t change the reality of the situation.

    • +1 Isabella.

      The Rays are running out of steam. Not much enthusiasm for them when I was in Tampa in August.

      If AA’s rebuild fails by 2015, what’s next?

  7. I’m not expecting the Jays to spend a TON of money of players this offseason, you know, like Greinke or Hamilton etc Not even sure I’d want them to, to be frank.

    But I do expect SOME greater level of investment this year. Someone like an Edwin Jackson. Like a second tier free agent. Despite this SHIT second half, I think this team could easily be pushed into the contention conversation with a couple a key that shouldn’t break the bank if they’re willing to boost payroll to middle of the pack.

    But AA’s comments on payroll make me wonder if we’ll even see that.

    Doesn’t make it hopeless, the Jays have the minor leaguers to make trades. But it is frustrating.

  8. So according to AA the Jays do not have anything close to a top 5 payroll. The 5th highest payroll according to some random website is Texas at about $130 million. This means that at the most we are looking at about $120-125 million payroll. The current roster should be paid roughly $90-95 million next year after arbitration. That means that the jays have roughly $30 million left on the payroll. It’s SERIOUSLY messed up that the richest owner in baseball with its own broadcasting rights is unable to spend enough money to sign Grienke for $20 million and an average 2B and LF for say $5 million each for example. Especially with a rise in attendance and all of the money coming in from the uniform change.

    • Revenues derived from the new uniforms goes to pool that is ditributed equally to all MLB teams.
      Grienke ain’t commin, he’s already vetoed a trade to the Jays and has many options as a FA.
      And at 95 mil, the Jays have plenty of room to make the RIGHT move, as opposed to a payroll at 130 and less room to aquire somebody high priced. if they were available.

      • I never heard that he vetoed a trade, the Jays were just on his no trade list. Big difference

      • Yes revenues from merchandise are shared equally, but seeing all the blue jays outfits downtown is like a walking billboard which encourages fans to check out the team.

    • It’s sad because the Jays fans did show up this year with increased attendance & tv ratings & merchandise sales etc, yet Rogers is like Kucy pulling the football away frm Charlie Brown..

      If AA doesn’t put a competitive team on the field by April 2 2013, the pitchforks will be out for Rogers.

  9. Someone once told me that SkyDome is the biggest licensed venue in Ontario…

    With$10 beers…I wonder if it isa liquor license…or Li sense to print money! Heyooo Amirite?

  10. Hopefully, AA’s reluctance to say anything that might get fans’ hopes up regarding free agent spending is just part of a philosophy to under-promise and over-deliver…. you know, he’s the yin to Beeston’s yang.

  11. How is Anthopolous not a politician? He can go in circles for days, never cornering himself on anything. It’s incredible.

    I feel for him a little. I think it would be exciting to see what he could do with some money, but it looks a little more each week that hopes for Rogers spending what they should are little more than a pipedream.

    • What should he do? It takes two parties to make a deal. You want him to predict the future? Because he says he’ll raise the payroll an arbitrary 15M, now Josh Hamilton will agree to that price?

    • And what’s he supposed to say.
      “we’re gonna spend like drunken sailors on shore leave”?
      And IF the FA’s are way over priced or they don’t wish to sign and he fails to sign the better ones,should he settle for class “C” FA’s just to show he could?
      That’s what I want,have AA spend just for the sake of spending.
      Why not renegotiate EE and Bautista’s contracts and pay them double? That way payroll is up and the Jays are gauranteed the playoffs.
      Jeez.

      • +1

      • Want I want? Stop asking him the fucking question, it’s beyond redundant.

        I don’t fault Alex for a damn thing. It’s his corporate masters that have pretty much finished what the Belgians started.

      • That’s a fair point RADAR.

        Maybe AA is trying to keep low expectations, but whatever happens he has to produce a team on paper on April 2 2013 that can win 90 games.

  12. I’m perfectly satisfied. I just have no idea what you guys expect him to say.

    It all depends on the deal(s) in front of him. And that’s how I want it. I don’t want him spending in a last ditch effort to produce a winner and save his job. Nor spending just to fill out his budget so he doesn’t lose the money next year.

    Why would he promise to, say, increase the budget 30M this year? What if he makes a great deal that takes up 18 of it and then sees nothing else of value? Then you all pile on him. You will use it against him. And so will CV’s agent and everyone else’s agent. It just makes no sense.

    And what happens if they’ve used their “stated” payroll and then Doc is available for 5M? You want Rogers to slam the door on him?

    He has a good situation – he isn’t so worried for his own skin that he signs anyone of immediate value. And when a deal is compelling enough it seems it is his to argue for.

    You all want to be included like you work in his office. Not going to happen.

  13. Congrats, Omar.

  14. sure would be fun to run into AA drunk at a bar, just wanting to get things off of his chest.

  15. Wilner just called us all idiots.

  16. One of the worst things about these injuries is that they are such a built-in excuse for this team if nothing gets done coming into next year. AA is able to (honestly by the way) point to the improvement of specfic players “before they went down.” I can already see that the implication is that this was a team on the cusp of contention, which frankly it just wasn’t.

    There’s nothing I hate more than this constant promise that ‘the money will be there when the time is right.’ We just lucked into two of the best hitters in baseball, in their primes, at below market cost, but somehow they don’t represent the proper core around which to accelerate the rebuild. Because this situation is totally replicable.

    This has been repeated ad nauseum by everyone but its a simple fact. The Blue Jays need to enter next season with at least one more Major League Pitcher on the roster. And that’s not a condemnation of AA; as far as I’m concerned he’s replaced a team of question marks with a team of explanation points and blank spaces. Now he just needs to fill them.

    • +1. You can see the Rogers apology tour beginning. “before they went down” as the new meme.

      AA conveniently forgets that the team was 31-30 before Morrow got hurt.

      I suspect the team would have won 80-85 games if healthy, because Romero would still suck & I can’t expect Hutch & Drabek to be greater than whhat Happ & Laffey & Villa gave us.

      • Is your beef with AA or Rogers Oakville? Cause you seem to change your mind every day.

        It’s as though you think AA should be better at his job as GM just because Rogers sucks as an owner.

        • My beef is with Rogers. Rogers refuses to provide AA with the resources he needs to build a competitive team.

          I get mad at AA when he tries to defend Rogers as saying 80 million is enough. He comes across as a corporate stooge.

          This fiasco where he now he said he wanted to release Escobar?

          That is a reactonary move that the real AA would pounce on if another team got mad at a player who did the same thing.

          Rasmus was upset in St Louis. Escobar was upset in Atlanta.Morrow was digruntled in Seattle as a reliever.

          The big problem was Farrell & the other Latinos did nothing about Escobar’s stupid eye patch.
          Escobar was dumb to wear it, but where is the leadership on this team. Was Omar /Babe Ruth afraid to confront Yunel?

          AA is a very bright young GM, & I wish he would work for a real team that gave him the tools to fix the team. However,his defence of Rogers is over the top .

          • If you actually listen to the AA interviews with McCown & Brady & Lang, AA is being led on to say “yeah, we considered suspending him for the year, releasing him”.

            I don’t believe he actually ever considered it. It’s similar to when McCown and Cox suggested the Jays release Stroman and any future players caught for PEDs.

            Unless it becomes a huge shitstorm with the fanbase in TO, Escobar is still an asset.

      • Not a meme.

  17. What bugs me the most about this whole thing, and how media guys like Bob McCown et al are handling/covering it; is that they keep comparing what Escobar did to ‘what if I did it, as a Rogers employee?’ I guess, I sort of get why (because Rogers owns the Jays), but if the Jays were still owned by Labatt’s (or whatever) would he care so much? I doubt it, I really do.

    Who cares who owns the Jays when dealing with this problem. It doesnt matter. If Prince Fielder did the same thing, would those comparisons be made? Unlikely…

    Stop with the ridiculous comparisons.

    • It’s also an invalid analogy…Escobar is represented by the most powerful labour union in all of sports…they just might grieve a season ending suspension.

      Rogers Corp media personnel (i.e. employees like Bob “133 inch TV” McCown, the employee formerly known as Damian Goddard, etc.) work in a non-union environment.

  18. I read the article. I got this: AA cannot do what he wants to do. It’s bugging him now. The fact is Rogers are never going to back the truck up. AA needs 100 million a season AND the ability to go get someone they need when they need it. He can’t do it today, couldn’t yesterday and from what I gather, will not be able to in the offseason. He’s still done a great job rebuilding the organization. But if it was me, I’d take my wife and family elsewhere for employment. A veteran GM would demand that money in this division, especially given the resources of ownership and market size and if refused, tell Rogers to go take on Boston and NY with a 75 million payroll…and we know how that story ends.

    • If I was AA I would stick it out with the Rogers beancounters till 2015 or 2016, by which time if the Jays haven’t won more than 88 games they will fire him, so he will be happy & go to any other team with an excellent resume & build a championship team.

      Rogers is secretly doing him a favor because by continuing to limit payroll, he can say he tried his best in the AL East with an 80-90 million payroll.

      If he gets 120 million in the NL, he can win a world series.

      If Rogers gave him a 140 million & AA got the wrong free agents, he would be bashed like jp riccardi.

      The low payroll gives him an excuse as to why he can’t compete.

    • @ Dave

      I wholeheartedly agree with this. AA is a talented young GM and there are plenty of other organizations that would love to have him. Maybe that’s what the owners need. If AA defects it will be the first time since Gillick that a GM left voluntarily and it will say a lot about what this team is and how it’s perceived.

      It’s amazing to me that I have gone from someone who shared season tix and went down to the RC maybe 35 times a year and watched the other games on tv to someone who didn’t go to the RC once this season and watches occasionally on tv when I can be bothered. And that was before the injuries scuttled the team. After years and years, I’ve had enough of mismanagement and failure. It would take quite a bit to get me back there and buying season tickets again. I don’t know how many other people feel the way I do. I’m sure I’ll be accused of not being a true baseball fan. But there it is. I’m halfway out the door.

  19. I learn more from Chinese fortune cookies than from Anthopoulos speaking. It’s all equivocation and double speak. He has refined the fine art of talking greatly but saying nothing. And that’s okay.

  20. The Beest is on PTS right now.

    • PTS: Paul is not impressed with YE would be an understatement given that interview. And, he’s taking full responsibility for the situation. I think, despite the comment that the Jays prefer to work with the players, YE is leaving Town sooner rather than later. AH had two hits again today.

      • It would be dumb for the Jays to trade Yescobar now when his value is low.
        because they want to appease the mouth breathers like Mccowan who have blown this issue way out of proportion.

        I am all for gay rights with gay friends for many years, but the media makes it sound that Yunel beat up someone at a gay pride parade.

        I would like Mccowan to be as outraged the next time a Maple Leaf gets a DUI.

        Yunel is responsible for the dumb message, but the entire cplaying roster on saturday should have known what was going on including Farrell.

  21. “And how much could potentially be in that truck? Well… it’s not Alex’s job to know.”

    LOL. So the GM of a MLB club is completely unaware of the value of broadcast rights yet knows the scouting prospects at A level of other clubs. Totally unacceptable.

    “I know what you’re saying, all our games are on Sportsnet/Rogers owns Sportsnet – it’s like the YES thing for the Yankees,” he says when asked about the shiny new cable deals that are powering spending around the league. “I’m never involved in those discussions and those meetings, it’s all way above me.”

    True he is not involved in those negotiations, but he knows the reds, padres etc are getting more money to plow into payroll . Can he really justify 80 million as sufficient to compete in the AL east given his prospects can’t produce at a sufficient level to compete.?

    “I know it is not what everybody wants to hear, but it is the truth,” Anthopoulos says at one point, summing up the entire conversation quite well. “It is a combination of things. Our payroll has gone up and everyone expects it to be significantly greater than it is, but it isn’t in a bad area.”

    Sigh.

    I mean… it’s not bad news by any stretch, it’s just… sigh.

    Stoeten has joined the braying hordes of fans who want a competitive team. :)))) No more fapping to prospect porn.

  22. Silver lining time. I want Hech at short next year. The man is a gifted athlete and in my humble opinion, he is ready.
    Yunel, I’d say we need you at second next season, it gives us the best infield in the league. He can’t be that dumb that he doesn’t know that Hech is a once in a decade defensive talent, in the most important position up the middle.If he whines, I take that as he really didn’t learn his lesson. He would be still all me me me, I dump him for a box of balls. Do what is good for your team mates Mr Escobar or here is the door, don’t let it hit yah where the good Lord split yah.
    If he smrtens up and stays, a long shot I admit, I want Yunel in the 2 hole.
    If Gose shows any more improvement with his OBP, he leads off. The man is a thermonuclear weapon when he is on base. Davis is gonna be 33, I’ll pick up his option then trade his ass. It’s not like he is gonna improve.

  23. Just tossing this out there. But what about something like Yunel Escobar for Jemile Weeks?

    Oakland seems to have soured on Weeks and b4 this incident they were heavily linked with Yunel. Before this incident, I think Yunel would have been worth more than Weeks. Maybe it’s even now?

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