I still can’t say for certain that this will become a regular feature around here for the early winter (looking like it, though, huh?), but again today, with all kinds of movement happening on the trade and free agent markets, and all kinds of decisions being made on players throughout the league who may wind up having some bearing on the Jays’ plans for the off-season, I think it will be a valuable exercise to comb through the latest from the astonishingly fantastic and comprehensive MLB Trade Rumors and add some Jays-related context to whatever is going on out there…

Dr. Kenny Ken Ken Rosen Rosen is reporting, as the GM meetings begin in Indian Wells, that the Diamondbacks are actively looking to move Justin Upton. He’s a hell of a player, but the Jays don’t likely have the talent to make it happen– Arizona isn’t rebuilding, so they need MLB-ready pieces back, and they don’t need a catcher, so that rules out JP Arencibia. The D’Backs just picked up Cliff Pennington in the Chris Young deal, but Rosenthal notes that they do still need a shortstop. Escobar or Hechavarria alone won’d get it done, though, and what other big league pieces would actually intrigue anyone looking to move this calibre of player, honestly? Using one of those guys to get a pitcher out of the desert as a third party in a deal? That I’d buy. But Upton’s a pipe dream.

Meanwhile, and speaking of one of their pitchers, Jerry Crasnick is tweeting that some in the Arizona organization aren’t so high on Trevor Bauer anymore, so the club is actively engaged in trying to move him. There were definitely issues there, especially when he reached the Majors, and they’d be magnified if he actually somehow wound up here in the AL East, but that’s a guy I’d move one of the Lansing Three for real quick– not that I think Arizona would be interested. Add a shortstop though…? I mean, it’s taking away from a future rotation to add to the present, and really, is it any more likely that Bauer flames out than Syndergaard or Nicolino? Is it maybe the same faction in Arizona souring on him who thought it was a good idea to move Jarrod Parker for Trevor Cahill? Fuck, do it, roll the dice.

Not at MLBTR just yet, but speaking of Rosenthal, and worth noting, is a tweet that went like this: “#BlueJays, in their search for a manager with experience, made contact with Mike Hargrove. Does not appear to have progressed.” Um… thankfully. I think. I mean, the Human Rain Delay? Pffft.

Holy fucking fuck right off, Jeremy Guthrie. The free agent, and former Orioles and Rockies pitcher, who had some nice success in Kansas City at the end of the season after spending most of it pitching like everybody else does in Colorado, is reportedly looking for a three-year deal worth $34-million. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, ten million really is the new five million. And it’s going to be a long couple of years if Rogers continues to force the Jays to play by the old financial rules. Then again, most teams will probably laugh in Guthrie’s agent’s face on this one.

According to Jon Morosi, the Orioles may be a surprise suitor for Josh Hamilton, which would be totally hilarious, though one of those things I’m deathly afraid would work out really well for them just to spite me. Kind of like… um… 2012. But be that as it may, I’d be willing to bet some money that the Orioles end up signing someone this winter that we actually want, and everybody freaks the fuck out about it. Ugh. It’s totally going to be insufferable, I just know it.

Matt Harvey and Zack Wheeler are off-limits, but the Mets are reportedly willing to trade anybody else, and they’re looking for a catcher. Um… might I interest them in a power-hitting on-base sinkhole that one of their AGM’s once drafted? And all I’d ask in return is Daniel Murphy or (if you maybe want a B prospect, too) John Niese. Huh? Huh? Huh?

As we mentioned earlier in the afternoon, the Mets and Jason Bay have agreed to part ways– with the Mets still kicking in all the money they owe Bay because… there was no other way to get him off their team. I bring it up again to note that…. as much as I enjoy shitting on the sacred cows of maple dicks, and as much as I’m confident Bay is no longer an MLB-calibre baseball player, I wouldn’t kill anyone for wanting to see him get a minor league invite to camp. OK assholes???

According to Joel Sherman of the New York Post, the Yankees won’t really be looking at top tier free agents this winter, though they will be considering a nine-figure extension for Robinson Cano. Ahh that looming luxury tax stuff sure is sweet. Stay old, Yankeeboys.

Sherman also has some notes on the A’s, who are claiming they’ll bottom-feed for a shortstop this winter– so, no deal involving Escobar and a pitcher returning?– and also saying that they’re not going to deal any of their extraneous outfielders, as they intend on rotating Cespedes, Young, Crisp and Reddick. So, y’know, don’t go trying to pry away an outfielder with a shortstop, you crazy other teams. Because they so won’t do it!

Mariners GM Jack Zduriencik says he might take a recording around with him so he doesn’t have to constantly tell people that he’s not trading Felix Hernandez. So, y’know, stop asking.

According to Buster Olney, Francisco Liriano, Stephen Drew and Melky Cabrera are guys who may take a one-year deal somewhere, just to build up value to re-enter the market again in 2013. Are the Jays now that team? Sure, why the hell not?

The Cubs are looking for pitching, and for the same kind of deals they made last year– like how they smartly netted Paul Maholm for $4.5-million plus an option, then flipped him for decent prospects when it became clear he was a bargain. That’s a pretty strong model to follow in free agency, letting you hedge on the season, while forcing you to get guys with more years of control via trade, which is probably a smarter way to do it anyway, given they’ll be a whole lot cheaper.

The Clevelands aren’t keen on moving their best players– Shin-Soo Choo and Justin Masterson chief among them, at least where the Jays’ interest is concerned– but they’re keeping an open mind. Choo is a platoon guy and Masterson isn’t great, but they’d sure be improvements, and Cleveland is one of the few clubs who might be willing to acquire strictly futures, as I don’t think anyone there has any illusions about where they are in their championship arc (i.e. way at the fucking bottom).

Lastly, in the most shocking news of the day, the agent for Dan Haren says that his client is totally healthy. Because… what the hell else was he going to say?

Comments (58)

  1. To: Andrew Stoeten

    Why do the D’backs want to trade Upton so badly?

    • Who do I look like? Kevin Towers?
      More like Twin Chin Towers

      I don’t respond to good questions.
      I only respond to idiots who post dumb comments so I can look witty by insulting them while my beard soaks up my beer spillage.
      Burp.

  2. Haren is healthy !? There’s no way that trade gets pulled off the table if Dan haren is anywhere close to being healthy.

  3. Ike Davis would look good in an jays uni

  4. Cmon is upton really a pipe dream? Why do you have to ruin all the fun?

  5. The “Justin Upton is available” meme is becoming tired. They really need to, you know, shit or get off the pot.

  6. Also, one other player you didnt mention on clevelend is cabrera. He would be an intiguing option at 2b to say the least. Its been a while since the jays had a decent switch hitter. He would help balance out the lineup, has some pop and plays good d. He would my #1 target on cle I would say.

  7. Not sure why you’re so convinced Upton is not doable, Stoetes. What realistically does any other team have to offer that the Jays don’t? If we use the hypothetical starting point of a shortstop, I’m not convinced something like Sierra + Janssen doesn’t get some consideration.

    There’s a whole lot of OF depth in the free agent market, can anyone think of a team that would conceivably put up something better then that? I wouldn’t expect Texas to move Olt or Profar.

    • Texas is the one team that comes to mind that could easily beat the jays offer if they include andrus or profar. It depends how bad they want upton. Other than that, not sure how many teams have the pieces stoeten is talking about and the need for upton.

    • Arizona has outfield depth– which is why Upton could theoretically be moved. They have starting pitching depth, they have a catcher locked up, and they’re not looking to add prospects, primarily.

      What do the Jays have to offer that will fit a need for them? Escobar and bullpen pieces don’t come close, I don’t think, unless you add a couple of your best prospects– and also your best trade chips in your quest for pitching. Depth guys like Sierra and Cooper aren’t worth even mentioning.

      Morrow would help them, Lawrie, Bautista and Encarnacion would too, but those are all lateral moves for the Jays. They’d start a conversation, sure, but not one the Jays will get very far in to, I’m very sure.

      The pieces just don’t fit for it to make a lot of sense. Or am I missing something?

      • Worth considering that they could work a 3-team deal with someone who IS looking to add prospects.

        • This is just a thought, but what would Bautista do in a deal for upton. To much? Could you get upton+ back? How bout encarnacion?
          Reason I mentioning is upton is younger 25, has 3 years left on contract and is Bautista and encarnacion really going to be around when this team is ready to contend? They are a few pieces away from being a playoff contender let alone a WS contender.

          • If the Jays were to trade Bautista he would go to the highest bidder. If I was AA I wouldn’t trade him barring a big overpayment. In a year or two it could be a different situation though.

          • Considering both Bautista and EE have 3 years left on their deals, as does Upton, then the “will they be around” doesn’t make much sense, does it?

            • I guess I ment “will they be around and still producing”.
              Everyone needs to take a deep breath and realize sometimes things don’t work out as fast or at all. Yes jays have been saying next year,next year but honestly would you rather the, blow up there farm system on 3 or 4 guys this year and have nothing left or trade now and wait for hech, gose, d’arnaud, marisnick, Lansing 3 and even Lawrie to actually be ready/producing. Think of the prospects you could add with, Bautista, encarnacion, Escobar, Rasmus, JPA moved in the next year or 2

    • Hahahahaha ..
      Hahahahaha ..

      Wait .. Gonna try and say something in between laughing hysteria…

      Escobar, Sierra and Jansen for Justin Upton .. And they would listen .. Come on dude .. You actually have to know something about baseball to reading blogs in November – I guess whatever you are reading, aint sinking in.

      Why would Arizona trade a potential franchise player for a decent SS, a decent RP and a 4th OF at best?

      But if they do insist on this package, I’ll take it

      BB

      • It’s not a ridiculous package to get trade talks going. What about Escobar, Janssen, one of the lansing pitchers, and Sierra? Or substitute Sierra for another similar prospect. How about:

        Escobar, Janssen, Aaron Sanchez, Anthony Gose

        For

        Upton, John McDonald

      • Only a true fucking numpty would sign their initials on a fucking comment. Bravo

  8. Choo/Davis platoon? Sure!

  9. Jose Altuve was rumored to possibly be on the trade block earlier in the season. the little man would look good in a Jays youth sized uni next year.

  10. I know this is considered sacrilegous around these parts but maybe the jays should consider trading lawrie? I mean, not actively shopping him, but willing to listen. I was not impressed with him at all from an offensive standpoint. His plate discipline was very poor which I did not expect after they supposedly drilled it into him the previous year in vegas. His baserunning was terrible as well. He is young though and can improve but sometimes we say that and players never end up improving much. But really, trading him all depends on what the jays get back. Two other players I would not be surprised at to be traded this offseason is rasmus and/or gose.

    • If there was actually a way to improve the team by trading Lawrie, sure, go for it.

      But he’s cheap and his “disappointing” full season debut still produced 3 WAR while missing quite a few games.

      Not to mention whatever little extra revenue a potential Candian impact player can have for the Jays. It might be a very small amount, but it needs to be factored in as well.

      I highly doubt anyone will give the Jays more than what Lawrie is worth. Players like him typically don’t get traded after 1 year of service time.

    • I could see AA being willing to trade Lawrie in the right deal, but I honestly feel like Beeston/Rogers wouldn’t let him.

      • I think Lawrie could be traded for the right package. AA is cold-blooded that way and I don’t think Beeston would stand in his way. Except as of right now we have no one to play 3rd base.

        I think we might be in with a chance on Cabrera. He might like to play in what he might regard as a town with easy-going fans and a fairly benign group of journalists. He might see it as a kind of AAAA assignment to get back in the game.

      • Lawrie for King Felix?

    • I think they need to set a limit on how many Red Bulls he consumes a game.

    • I’ve said it a few times and will say it again…I don’t think Rasmus will ever really get it, has morphed , really , into a fukstik ( although with a decent year he can escape that like a Hill) who lloks like it’ll be a struggle for him to hit in excess of of .250. He simply strikes out too much ( team affliction) and simply pulls the ball way too much, often playing pepper with the second baseman for weeks at a time.
      I can see him being moved to a place like Cleveland either for Kipnis (2b) or Masterton. We likely w/h have to include another piece
      I don’t think Houston would want hime for Altuve.. they would want more kids
      Rumour somewhere today that the BJs are looking at Keppinger of TB for 2b as aFA. Other than Scutaro, this guy struck out the LEAST in MLB and had OPA of 360. He;d be cheaper and better than KJ obviously although I really like this Altuve kid

    • Can you please fuck off?

  11. Justin Upton has produced WAR over the last 3 years, which include 2 disappointing years based on the lofty expectations. Over the next 3 years he is owed $40 mil.

    What would the projections for the next 3 years be? Based on his age, maybe 12 – 15 WAR?

    Melky Cabrera could probably be had for 3 years and $20 mill. I don’t buy this notion that he is a lock to sign a one year deal to prove he can hit without PEDs. He could have done that last year if he chose to.

    What would the projections for Cabrera be over the next 3 years? Maybe 9 WAR?

    Justin Upton may very well be a consistent superstar beginning with 2013. But it’s not like he’s that cheap at this point. I doubt he’ll be worth the cost.

  12. Agreed. I would definitley be making a play for Melky. JB would smarten him up real quik and I think he would do great here. I think you could get him for 3/23. /mon AA get off your ass. Getting Melky would make it easier to unload rasmus

  13. Jonah Keri made a point on PTS tonight which is a legitimate argument for the “Rogers is Cheap” camp.

    While complimented by the reasonable national and regional television revenue argument, he noted that the Jays have already secured two significant below market value assets in both Bautista and Encarnación. In addition, reminded us that many other players are in cost effective pre or early arbitration years.

    He went on to illustrate the point that there is little reason for the Jays not to pay actual (or a little above) market value for a Zack Greinke type because they are already benefiting from so many discounted contracts.

    Simply put, how many steals does AA need to have before he pays the sticker price on something.

    This is an argument that we most all already kind of know, but Keri articulated it well.

    http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/2012/11/05/pts_jonah_keri_talks_blue_jays_free_agent_targets/

  14. I bet you could suck a golf ball through a garden hose!

    • What is your major malfunction numbnuts? R. Lee Ermey for manager? He’d straighten out the clubhouse I bet.

  15. I think Murphy and Niese would be great additions. Combine this with $12m per year FA starting pitcher and we’re looking pretty good. Then you give LF to Moises for the year, call up Lou Brown to come manage the club…. and every time we win a game we peel a section. Done!

  16. I don’t believe that Upton is a pipe dream for a second. A few points;

    1. There’s a reason people say Escobar is worth more than we think – he is! People respect the talent he showed in 2011 and seem willing to blame last season on the loss to injury of the team’s vets.

    2. Why does Arizona still have outfield depth after trading Upton & Young? I have no doubt that Gose would interest them.

    3. This is by far the weakest point, but it is verrrry possible that Arizona has seen what they have in Hill and believe that Jays players are simply poorly coached in their approach. Possible that Adam Lind could be appealing to them. Wouldn’t be the first time.

    In conclusion, I don’t see why Escobar, Gose, Lind and a Dan Norris caliber late top 10 prospect wouldn’t get some serious consideration. And if I’m the Jays, I’m happy to give that up.

  17. Davidi:

    One interesting thing I’ve heard. Sounds like #Jays may soon sign a 2B (don’t know who yet). Probably in next few days if it goes down

    https://twitter.com/ShiDavidi/status/266347747374948352

    • So…Izturis, Keppinger or Theriot? If it were Theriot I might puke from now ’till the end of time.

      My guess is Izturis.

      • Keppinger would be the best option but im not really excited about any 2b free agents.

        • Keppinger for 1-2 years would be a solid signing, as long as it isn’t overly expensive. Not really thrilled with the others.

    • I’d love if AA moved quickly and picked up Keppinger for 2b/UT and McCarthy and/or Stauffer for the rotation. Hopefully there’s some real value in those 3 guys and AA gains a ton of trade leverage by not having so many needs on the trade market – where I think the real impact moves will come.

    • Izturis would replace Aviles for likely a similar price.

      Maybe Lawrie, Escobar, Hech are the starters with Izturis picking up 300 – 400 PAs when those guys need a rest/Lawrie DHs.

  18. Bleacher Report living up to its reputation. Looks like they have an article about bringing Jason Bey home to Canada.

    • would be a fail all the hush hush on a 2b if it was jays resign kj……

      • there are other guys I would Rather they take a flyer on as a platoon player, Reed Johnson types. falling star not so much.

    • If Bay remains unsigned for the winter I wouldn’t mind picking him up on a minor league deal. He is probably embarrassed and might believe he is too young to pack it in. He was still a major league player in 2011 and 2010, albeit a below average one.

  19. Im coining the phrase “encartista”, as in “encartista go back to back!” or more likely, “encartista on the dl again? Aw, man”

  20. Stoeten, you want Daniel Murphy for Aaron Cibia straight up? That’s ridiculous…

    Murphy’s bat isn’t particularly good, and his defensive metrics are shitty at second base. Arencibia for a legit second baseman makes sense, but I don’t think Murphy’s anything close to that.

    Arencibia is one of the most valuable trade chips the Jays have, I would much rather see Arencibia+prospects for a pitcher (like Niese)

    • I have been advocating a Murphy for JPA deal for weeks. I would do it.

      What, are you in love with JPA being a good RBI guy who can hit for power?

      Murphy is a perfect no. 2 hitter, with good OBP skills and a decent bat. Sure, his defense isn’t all-star level, but with Hechavarria or Escobar, and Lawrie, he doesn’t need to be an-star defender. He’s certainly would be steadier than Jeff Keppinger.

      The Jays cannot be expected to keep JPA and d’Arnaud. JPA for Murphy straight up.

      • Murphy’s a good singles hitter. He’ll go the other way, he’ll go up the middle. As long as it’s a single, he’ll… do that. Can’t hit for power, can’t field, can’t run the bases, doesn’t like to walk all that much. More than Arencibia, anyway… ha.

        But I don’t really know what good 2B options are out there. I don’t know, Mets sure could use a catcher.

        • Murphy had 40 doubles in 2012 and 10 stolen bases. His triple slash line of .291-332-403 isn’t terrible. OPS of over .800 in 2011.

          Not Robinso Cano numbers but not bad for a fairly cheap option at 2B.

          • The difference for me is Arencibia is a catcher, and Murphy is a wannabe second baseman, more like a third or first baseman. And his bat doesn’t play at first base unless you want another DB Cooper.

            I think Arencibia and something will be enough for a decent starting pitcher, and right now that’s way more important than a mediocre solution at second base.

            Not only that, but Hechavarria could probably provide the same value from better defence and slightly worse offence

          • I’ll admit, had no clue about the 40 doubles. That is more than I would’ve guessed.

  21. Johnny? Johnny! JOHNNY!!!

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