I think I can probably, by now, say for certain that this will become a regular feature around here for the early winter, as again today, with any number of rumblings out there on the trade and free agent markets, and all kinds of decisions being made on players throughout the league who may wind up having some bearing on the Jays’ plans for the off-season, I think it will be a valuable exercise to comb through the latest from the astonishingly fantastic and comprehensive MLB Trade Rumors and add some Jays-related context to whatever is going on out there…

Don’t tell the hopeless fans who constantly scoff at Alex Anthopoulos for his infatuation with cheap relievers, but it’s looking like he may have read the market right, as Jeremy Affeldt has followed in Brandon League’s big-money footsteps, reportedly re-upping with the Giants for three years, and $18-million. Affeldt has been terrific for the last two years– especially in 2012– so it’s not like he’s just any old reliever, but for a team with limited resources, I’ll take what Alex has been doing with pre-arb guys over that kind of outlay any day.

Cleveland could be a possible destination for Jason Bay, and if they want to give him an actual Major League contract, they can have him. Another possibility, though, is Melky Cabrera, “as the pressure-free environment in Cleveland could help him rebound next season.” Hey Melk Man, you want a pressure-free environment and an above average hitters park to help emphasize your turnaround? Do I have the place for you! A switch-hitting high on-base (at least when his BABIP is driving it) top-of-the-lineup left fielder? Uh… yeah, go get him, Alex. Fuck, give him a mutual option if you have to.

Both the Yankees and Red Sox are reportedly interested in free agent catcher Mike Napoli– who is insisting he wants to catch, largely because it means a heftier payday and a much shallower pool of talent than at first base, where he really probably should play. The Sox, of course, just signed David Ross, and already have Ryan Lavarnway and Jarrod Saltalamacchia on the roster. Salty might be dealt if they happen to land Napoli– or may be dealt either way– which some have speculated may cut into the potential market for JP Arencibia. That’s possibly true, though Saltalamacchia has only one year remaining before free agency, while Arencibia doesn’t even first hit arbitration until after 2014. So… they’re not going to go to anybody looking for quite the same thing, even if the production might be somewhat similar (if we’re being a little bit generous to JP).

Elsewhere behind the plate, it looks like AJ Pierzynski will be playing elsewhere next year, and Russell Martin is drawing interest from the Rangers. Unfortunately, as shitty as some of these catching options are, they’re certainly better than trading something that isn’t entirely redundant for Arencibia, right? I don’t think he’s going to bring back what a lot of fans have kinda hoped. Cheap, yes, but it’s not like these veterans are going to break the bank for a club like Texas.

Speaking of the Rangers, they’re interested in Torii Hunter, reportedly, but so are the Braves, Dodgers, Red Sox, Yankees and Tigers. He’ll reportedly go to an AL club, and Jim Bowden suggests Detroit is the frontrunner, which… given their outfield options, probably makes sense for them. He’d be a very attractive LF option for the Jays if he hit from the other side, I think– or, y’know, if he were at all interested in taking their money. Though, actually, he’s been decent against right-handers in three of the last four years– he put up a .303/.351/.446 line in 2012, for example– so I wouldn’t complain at all if their name cropped up in some of these reports as well. Again, though, who’s going to choose our shitty turf over legacy franchises with multiple playoff appearances in the rearview? Unless we pay him until he’s, like 41.

Ten million remains the new five million, as Cody Ross is reportedly getting all kinds of interest in his quest for a three-year, $25-million deal. And OK, he had a .345 wOBA this year, so he’s not nothing, but still. Still. And apparently the Phillies don’t quite think they’re old and broken down enough, and may be interested in paying Josh Hamilton a really high AAV on a short-term deal. What, are they scared off by insane long-terms contracts that have backfired on them or something?

The Dodgers’ potential signing of Hyun-Jin Ryu (they’ve already won the posting for him, but still need to come to terms) could throw one of their spare pitchers onto the trade market.  Chris Capuano, Aaron Harang or Chad Billingsley might come available, and (no, really?) one of them might be a fit here– or, at the very least, not terribly costly, and maybe surplus enough to be acquired with mostly just prospects and relievers. I dunno. Also: the Jays were one of the many teams, reportedly, who were aggressively scouting the South Korean.

Emmanuel Burriss is rather a rather unspectacular piece of middle infield depth, but he’s a free agent now, electing to hit the market after being outrighted off the Giants’ 40-man roster. Again, not a guy to contribute a lot, but it’s not like the Jays aren’t still a bit thin in the middle infield– especially if they end up dealing Escobar or Hechavarria to fill a rotation hole. Our friend and occasional podcast co-host Darren from Extra Base Hit tweets that the Jays have always liked him.

Lastly, Ken Davidoff of the New York Post thinks that Hiroki Kuroda and Zack Greinke may actually sign soon, and that the Dodgers may woo Kuroda back to the west coast– which I suppose would put the Yankees in a position to go looking for another starter on the free agent market. Not exactly the best scenario for a Jays club fishing in that pond, is it?

Comments (172)

  1. Summarizing a link summary site feels like stealing page clicks.

    • Then you probably shouldn’t be reading or commenting on it, huh?

      Oh but wait, you’re that Nelly tool only with a name change, so you can’t help but spew out nonsense. Disregard.

      • Clever response…

        • El Douche-o Baggo

          Seriously though, if you don’t realize the Jason-Parksian reductive pretentious hipster sarcastic commentary value add that Stoeten brings to the [ost, then why the fuck are you reading this site? In all seriousness, why?

      • lol personally I don’t get why people get upset by this. Like I said in the other thread the other day I love it. You’re not the only one that does it, Olney at ESPN has been doing it for ages. In addition to compiling the links which saves me a ton of searching, you’re good enough to give me a synopsis and a comment or two. Maybe it was the same guy complaining yesterday with a different name.

        • @night manimal. Agreed. These links are helpful to keep up to date with the ML.

          I don’ t have time to go looking for the links everywhere.

          Stoeten provides a valuable service for fans.

          • It pains me to say it, but I agree with you oakville. Hehe.

            Its wicked to get a summary of links here.

            As another commenter pointed out the other day also, his workplace has sites like mlbtr and espn blocked, but he can get to djf. So, meh.

          • I wish he’d validate parking.
            Other than that, DJF is close to one stop shopping.

        • +1

          If only Stoets clipped coupons too. I’d be set!

        • + Billion and Billions
          I love reading what people say in here. Stupidity (as noted above) doesnt get a free ride.

      • Grow up asshole.

      • My internet = Drunk Jays Links and naked ladies.
        Both get a rise out of me.

    • But each item at least is linked and the comments are almost all with a Jays fan’s take on the news.

    • The monkey army hath spoken and I admit my wrongness.

      In all honesty, I didn’t know the links went to MLBTR, I thought they went to the original stories.

      Good over-reactions though.

  2. I was thinking it’s entirely possible halladay is back here in 2014. He might not get his vesting option in 2013 and he may not want to stay there anyways. Even if his numbers dropped he’d still be good value at 10 mil.

    • Only chance this happens is if the Jays look like contenders. I think he wants a WS ring more than anything and he could sign with any club he wants.

      • I doubt even then. Let’s let it go.

        • I’m just curious as to why you think Halladay would scoff at joining a contending Jays team?

          There were suggestions, at least by his wife I believe, that he’d like to retire in TO.

          I certainly wouldn’t expect him to come back if the Jays sucked or gave him a lowball contract offer.

          But if Philly misses the playoffs again, TO somehow wins the 2013 World Series and proceeds to offer Halladay a market contract, I assume a return would be his first choice by far.

          • It’s not completely out of the realm of possibility, it’s just, I’m very certain the Halladays have cut the cord a lot more cleanly on this one than the fans have, and that his time here wasn’t so magically wonderfulrifical that he’d jump at the chance to return to slog it out in our shitty stadium in front of fickle fans– or often the road team’s fans– in the toughest division in baseball.

            Who would?

            Sure the fact that the Jays’ spring training facility is near his home might help if things went south in Philladelphia– but hey, so is the Yankees!

            I think he showed the Jays more than enough loyalty with those two below market deals he gave them, and as much as fans love the returning hero narrative, he’s seen life outside this baseball backwater and for a guy who’ll be able to write his own ticket, that’s probably going to be enough.

            Not saying it can’t happen, but I don’t think he’s pining to get back here just as soon as the Jays look to be on the cusp, and frankly, the fantasy that he is, to me, is kinda sad. Or at the very least not worth the emotional investment. He was great, he’s moved on. Let’s also.

          • Don’t forget if the Phillies played .593 baseball the last two months of the season. Now they are talking about being able to potentially take on Hamilton’s contract. Who knows if it’s true of course. Nothing to say they’re not right back competing for the division again if Halladay is healthy. A rotation of Halladay, Lee and Hamels is still pretty impressive.

        • Fair enough.

          The chances of everything breaking right between the Jays winning, the Phillies losing and everything else are slim.

          I just think that if the money and chance at contention were equal, the Jays would be at the top of his list of destinations.

          He never wanted to leave and I’m quite certain he would have signed a third below market extension (the same one he gave to Philly) had the Jays been contenders.

          • The way I look at is he’s set to make $20 million next year. Add to that the cost in prospects it would take to get him and it’s a no-brainer that he would be too prohibitive. Split the $20 million on a starter and left fielder and use the prospects to trade for another. Add up the expected combined WAR for all 3 and Halladay would likely have to beast his career best WAR of 8.5 from 2011 to come close. Considering he had some very troubling injury issues last year I’d be very hesitant to put all my eggs in one basket even if it’s Roy.

            Believe me, I loved Roy when he was here. I would love to have him here still if Rogers actually spent like they could.

          • @night manimal

            If Halladay were to come back, it would likely be as a free agent next offseason, IF Toronto was a contender, IF Philly was not a contender and IF Rogers pays market value.

            It’s a longshot, obviously, but there’s a better chance of Halladay in the 2014 Blue Jays rotation than Greinke, imo.

    • That would be interesting. Let ‘s see… a 2014 pitching rotation of Halladay, Marcum, and McGowan.

    • Fans would go wild if Halladay returned in 2013 or 2014.

      It’s not completely crazy.

      Frankly, I would bring back Marcum, to add stability to the rotation. He could also take the heat of Ricky .

      • stability?!?!?! Really? He is rarely un-broken. Seriously, you want to rebuild by living in the past? I hear Candy Maldonado played a few games in LF, why not sign him while were at it…

        • Funny, I was watching the Jays 92/93 World Series’ wins and looked up Candy.

          He was a LOT better than I remember.

          I also looked up WAMCO. I don’t think a better lineup will ever be put together.

          The good ol’ days.

    • Halladay said at the end of this year that he wanted to finish his career in Philly. Very, very doubtful we ever see him back here in a Jays uni.

    • Because there is no team or player option, Halladay likely will be a free agent
      http://www.csnphilly.com/baseball-philadelphia-phillies/phillies-talk/Halladay-eyes-recovery-finishing-career-?blockID=720538

      following the 2013 season, a prospect he isn’t very worried about. Halladay’s long-term goal is to pitch for the Phillies for as long as possible.

      “It’s a year and a half away and ultimately it’s my goal to finish my career with the Phillies and win a World Series here,” Halladay said. “Some of those things aren’t fully in my control, but my intent is to play here and finish my career here and be here as long as I can. I don’t know what’s going to happen over the next year and a half, but I know from my side I’m going to make an effort to be here for as long as I can and finish here. I don’t want to go anywhere else.”

      • To be fair, what else is he going to say?

        “My goal is to fulfill my contract, but win a World Series and finish my career in Toronto”.

        He’s nothing if not diplomatic.

        But I’m sure if the Phillies are contending again in 2013, he’ll likely sign an extension there.

  3. Re: Kuroda going to Dodgers and Yankees

    If Kuroda decides to return to the Dodgers, I am not sure that the Yankees will be big spenders in free agency, given the luxury tax implications. Wendy Thurm wrote a great piece on this issue:

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-effects-of-the-luxury-tax/#more-104761

    Then again, we are talking about the fucking evil empire. So who the fuck knows?

  4. Lind is gonna be clutch this year! Go blue jays

  5. Trade for Ike Davis! Get it done AA
    I’d do it for JPA straight up

  6. Enough with the cheap relievers already, there’s no more room in the fridge! AA, fer fuck sakes, get us a #1 starter. I will let you in on a little secret, good pitching stops good hitting. I don’t want a rotation comprised of a bunch of #3 or #4 grade starters. This path we are on is madness I tell you.

    • Yes! Go get us a #1 starter! Its not as if they’re the scarcest commodity in baseball!

      JUST GO GET ONE!

    • Anyone know where to find some hen’s teeth? birddawg?

      • You guys are really emmersed in this Blue Jay penny pinching model. While the term ace wasn’t used, a friggin #1 guy at the top of the rotation is required. These guys are scarce? Really? Oh, I know, lets spend money and then that will take care of the pitcher scarcity issue.
        No doubt you deep thinkers will find problems with the laws of supply and demand, but I sure given time you might figure it out. Anyway back to cheap relievers because thats all you expct, know about, and will get from A fucking A

        • @birddawg. I share your frustration with AA but we have to wait till April 2, 2013 to see if AA can get any starting pitching.

          AA seems to be spooked by his failures to assemble a proper bullpen. So that’s his priority now.

          Free agency has begun, so we wait till the winter meetings.

        • I’m not trying to turn this into a debate about entry level of economics, but spending money wouldn’t make pitching of that quality less scarce

          The point is, you can’t just snap your fingers and go out and get a #1 starter (which, depending on which talent evaluator you ask, is a small pool of 8-12 guys). If you’re referring to a #1 starter in the completely ambiguous “this guy is the pitcher on our staff – THEREFORE #1″ sense, I’m pretty sure he has about, oh I don’t know, 4 months to get something done

          How many other teams have signed or traded for a top flight pitcher? Or a pitcher of any kind, for that matter? We’re in week two of free agency. Chill the fuck out

          • Dear Chill the fuck out, having some difficulty reading between the lines of “can’t just snap your fingers and go out and get a #1 starter” and ” We’re in week two of free agency” . Where the fuck are you getting a # 1 starter anywhere else? AA won’t trade for it!

          • Dear all-knowing-doucher, would you mind sharing your crystal ball with the rest of us? Are you privy to some sort of knowledge the rest of us aren’t? Or is these more blind, irrational conclusions based on jack shit?

            First of all, you need to give up hope of the team getting a true #1. There’s (maybe) one on the market and I’m pretty sure most of the teams with the few others aren’t willing to trade them. As far as really good starters (#2s or #3s), there’s a few on the market and I see no reason why Anthopoulos wouldn’t trade for one or two. Oh wait, that’s right, he didn’t trade for Gio or Latos last offseason so there’s NO WAY he’d trade for a good starter this offseason. Right

          • “Dear all-knowing-doucher” I guess the point is best made by you. Well said, enjoy your time here

          • @Red Areback:

            The birddawg is an acquired taste–not everyone’s cup of tea. His authentic side fights his meta-troll side, and it’s anybody’s guess who wins. He attracts vitriol and praise in roughly equal measure. He’s one of DJF’s true treasures.

          • If that’s the case, I’ll give credit where its due. He plays a fucking moron without missing a beat

          • It’s kind of his thing.

          • We gotta go back to checking ID’s here. Tell the mohters to ge the kids otta the basement Spud!

          • It’s the new frontier, ‘dawg; the Code Of The West abides, as should you, my friend. We reap only what is sown.

        • If you dont want an ace you’ve already ruled out Greinke and CC Sabathia, Tim Lincecum, Justin Verlander, David Price (or James Shields) (or Matt Cain) and a few others, Most of the #1s out there are on teams that wont give them up for any trade OR dont want what we’ve got to trade. Now, who’s left that the Jays can take a SS or C or CF or all three ( plus prospects)? Not too many. I like the talk about Dickey, but I honestly dont see that happening.

          • Carl an Ace would bew great, but that ain’t gonna happen with this team right now. I grow weary of the carousel of low ranked starters with “upside”. It makes you wanna puke listening to the drival that AA spews. GIVE ME SOME HOPE!

          • Sorry birddawg, there’ll be no romantic nights with Nurse Karen in Paris for you. Accept it and move on my friend.

          • @oakville who are you implying the Jays should have gotten by now then? We’re not getting Greinke, if you think it’s as simple as opening up the purse strings it’s not…we’re not L.A. or NY or Boston or the Angels, the blue jays can’t support a 130-150M payroll and once you add greinke and account for arb player’s raises over the next few years that’s where the jays payroll would go. You don’t need an ace or a so called #1, you can get to the playoffs with 5 aboe average starters, look at the A’s, or the O’s neither of those teams had so called “#1′s”

          • woops I meant @birddawg

          • Hey Josh, we get the #1 FA guy the only way Toronto can – we overpay! I really don’t understand the fan base that accepts losing as readily as the Jays fans. This team will be in a rebuilding mode in perpetuity until the owners spend. Throw out evey name you want to here, but I’m not biting, AA knows what it takes and who will come – get it done!

    • EXACTLY…

      I seriously cant believe the support being shown in here and on MLBTR for giving Sanchez a 6 year 90 million dollar deal. He is a #2 starter on his absolute best of days and a thin market should not inflate his value to that extent. He is a 10 million/year pitcher at best maybe 12 if things get nuts and no way should anyone give this guy 6 fucking years with his injury history. Ok so the guy has a no hitter, big deal, shittier pitchers have thrown a no hitter, sure he had a great rookie season but this isnt 2006. I have a buddy that was going on and on about Sanchez the other day talking about how wins and losses arent a big deal with pitchers,,, ok thats fair but when a pitcher has a losing record at Comerica park behind an offense like the Tigers, sorry but colour me unconvinced.

      My point here is that right now is the time for AA to either convince Rogers to pull out the checkbook while he pulls his dick and balls from between his legs and sign Greinke OR the more likely road of trading some of these stock piled prospects for at least ONE real, true fucking ACE. Romero is not an ace, never was, never will be, the guy is a number 3 on his best day, EVERY team in the East has a true, legit ACE pitcher apart from maybe the Orioles, Toronto hasnt had one since Halladay. It’s time for option A or B there is no C and there’s no room for the old AA excuse “we made phone calls but there just wasnt a deal to be made”.

      Sign a guy like Jackson or Marcum for the back of the rotation and then trade for a guy that can has the confidence of the fans and his team every time he toes the rubber. With Halladay whenever he did we always knew it was going to be a win or a great performance, it was rare to see otherwise. The fans and the team need that again. Period.

    • Stop improving the team AA!

  7. If this Kuroda deal goes down. I’m really starting to hate the new Dodgers.
    I liked it better when they were owned by a bumbling tycoon and his horn dog wife.

    • The only thing interesting about the new dodgers is to see how far they will go in terms of spending and where it will stop.

    • Better that they are in the NL than having someone like the other big spenders such the Yanks, Sox, Rangers, Angels or Detroit doing it.

      As far as I am concerned the Dodgers spending is just another example of just how much Rogers is underspending on the Jays. Again I am not saying the Jays market is the equal of the Los Angeles or New York markets, but it’s definitely in line or closer to Detroit’s or the Texas market.

      Check out Darren Rovell’s article and focus in on the amount of money they think the Dodgers are likely to make with their own network and add that to what we already know about teams with similar networks in New York and Boston. Toronto is no different. They are able to significantly understate the amount of revenue they generate to MLB. It’s one of the reasons the Jays were cut off from future revenue sharing alone with Houston.

      http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/dollars/post/_/id/2294/the-dodgers-are-hit-at-least-for-tv

    • They will spend like there’s no tomorrow and they still wont win a world series. I love watching high salary teams shit the bed in the post season or in general. The phillies epic shittiness made me happy this summer, so did the Red Sox fiasco. Those two epic failures actually made the Jays complete and total trainwreck almost ok because at least the jays had a good excuse.

      • Well just remember the Jays didn’t win a WS until the became the #1 payroll team as well.

  8. I think billingsley could have a big year. He has great stuff and when healthy he would fit in real nicely.

    • I like Billingsley as well, but he’s currently recovering from a partially-torn ulnar collateral ligament, for which he opted not to have Tommy John surgery. I hope he can make it back healthy, but it’s a tad worrying.

  9. I think stockpiling every reliever under the sun is a very smart idea, actually. Because once you hire Jim Tracy and implement a four man rotation, you’re probably going to need all the bullpen help you can get, amiright?

  10. Gah I wish we could afford Greinke…

    • They can afford Greinke, the Jays could actually afford any player they want. They could eclipse teams like Boston and New york in salary if they really wanted to spend like the Dodgers but they dont. Finding a happy medium between all out spending spree and cheap as taints would be nice though.

      • It’s worth noting, when dreaming of Roger’s billions, that operating profit at Rogers Wireless and Rogers Cable is approaching $4.8 billion, while operating profit at Rogers Media (of which the Blue Jays are a small portion) is less than $200 million.

  11. the dodgers are going to be a laughing stock. They are spending money like drunken sailors. They are like the housing bubble, eventually all the houses you bought will collapse and you will be stuck with worthless mortgages. When they are finished spending their 1/4 billion and they miss the playoffs then what?

  12. I would love them to sign Youkilis…

    • I agree but you would have to ditch Lind first though for the Jays to be able to get Youkilis the AB’s he would need to be worth the cost. On one had he could place first, third or DH but he would start to make the lineup pretty right handed heavy.

      Personally I really like Jays2010 suggestion of going after Gomes. He only made $1 million last year and even if he got $2 million it’s not that much more expensive than what you’re paying Mathis. He simply owns LHP .894 career OSP and would be a better bat to bring off the bench compared to Mathis against RHP too with his career .732 OPS.

      • I’d be pretty good with Lind being a slightly overpaid bench player. Who knows, maybe his back holds up and he ends up not being shitty.

    • The angst that a Youkilis signing would inflict on many a die-hard Masshole-hater, myself included, would be profound. How to cheer for the Puke? ~~~On the other hand, Stoeten would get record hits for days on end, if not weeks.

      • Yeah but at least he’s our asshole right?

        • I’m just saying the cruel contortions required to change my opinion concerning Youkilis would be awesome. Pavlov’s response.

          • It may take a couple of extra Anchor Steams, but you could get there SP, especially if he’s got an OPS around .850.

            • And just think how thrilled the Sux would be to see him in a Jays uniform standing in the batter’s box and staring at the guy who fingered him as the clubhouse snitch and basically got him run out of town. Let’s not forget how well Youk hits at Fenway.

          • He would certainly be hit by beaucoup de pitches playing against the Massholes. Hit Bobo!

    • Youkilis would be a perfect fit. He plays the same way as Lawrie intensity wise but could teach Lawrie how to do it the right way. He would be a great mentor for him in my opinion. He can play 1B, he can play 3B, he can DH and give them the ability to give lawrie a day off or a day at DH here and there. Hell youkilis came up as a fielder, you could probably tell him to head out to RF or LF for a game once in a blue moon and he would love it.

      He also takes a shitload of pitches and hits for power, contact and so on. Having him in front of Bautista in the line up would be a complete fucking goldmine.

  13. who says they’ll miss the playoffs?
    With a second WC they are almost a shoo in for one of them at a minimum. Besides they can make further adjustments (up or down ) next July 31 at the trade deadline. They might be a little caavlier about it, but , be honest, if you were a suffering LA fan, you would love that they are trying to address some of the holes with the easiest thing to trade—money! You can always get rid of it later if you have to.
    Now, if we could Rogers to spend some money, Then we could start getting happier too for we would have better players ( I suspect) and we would still have much of our youth brigade. Going El Cheapo wins very little and not very oftern in MLB

  14. If the Jays get a nice pitching piece, I wonder how the casual fans will react in terms of attendance. There has been such a swirling toilet bowl atmosphere around the team since the collapse, I wonder if there will be apathy until the wins are collected or if all will be forgiven with a new manager hire and a healthier team with new shiny bauble.

    MLB attendance has shown a past season carry over effect on numbers. Based on last season, the Jays may have an uphill battle on getting fans in the seats.

    • Let’s put it this way, getting a decent name through free agency won’t hurt. All you have to do is look at the buzz young players like Lawrie created last year. That said, it’s always going to be more to do with the wins than anything else imo. When the Jays were running hot in 2012, attendance was running closer to a 30,000 game average. When the season became essentially a write off it plummeted.

      I do think your last comment has a lot of merit to it though. That momentum can work both ways. I think with the right investments they can turn it around to start the season. If they don’t and teams like the Orioles and Boston make free agent splashes of their own it will be an uphill battle.

    • The swirling toilet bowl atmosphere is part of the Rogers Centre’s charm.

  15. I know this has been brought up before, but I’m going to bring it up again. AA should make an aggresive push for Dickey. JPA + Sierra + lesser prospect could get it done. If they land Dickey I’m sure they could sign him as long as they are willing to give him the term he wants. Maybe 4 years at 40 million?

    The way I see it, this is one of the few realistic options AA has if he wants to land a legit ace. If Dickey has 2,3,4 seasons left in him like his play from 2010-2012 then I think 3ish years of top quality pitching is worth quite a bit more than JPA, that is assuming Rogers is willing to sign him long term.

    • To me, Dickey is almost a perfect solution. He’s older so he isn’t going to command a long-long term contract.and would be a great ‘bridge’ for the guys in Lansing… and if they on’t sign him to an extension, Hutchison and Drabek are back in 2014, and there’s always Alvarez.

      I’d be totally on board with this.

    • Jimmy Bob-

      I’m sure the Jays could sign most anyone “as long as they were willing to give him the term he wants.” The strategy flies in the face of the Jay’s stated modus operandi of fewer years/higher average offer. Having said that, I too am warming to the idea of Dickey (but that’s coming from someone who thinks that old dudes rock. Not everybody’s cup of tea.)

      • I brought that up because Dickey wouldn’t sign with the Mets because of the term they offered was too short for his liking. If they were to trade for him, which is a realistic possibility, I think it would only be worthwhile if they signed him for a few more years. If the Jays were willing to offer the term he wants (which is within their 5 year maximum) then I think trading for him would be a perfect fit.

        Plus how awesome would it be having the league’s only knuckleballer? Teams would hate Toronto, plus that knuckleball would be that much more lethal in the dome.

      • In the grand tradition of (generally) knuckleballers and (specifcally) Tom Candiotti, AA should do everything to get it done. (What the hell., Candiotti was a peice on the way to their 1st WS). But not at the expense of neglecting whats going on in the rest of the market. What team in their right mind would trade their best pitcher after he got a Cy Young award? I wont happen but AA should be right there when/if it does.

    • Why in the world would the Mets consider that trade? Other teams could easily better that offer.

    • The man is about to win the Cy young, 10 mil per wont cut it. But Im onboard for the trade but something would have to come back with Dickey prospect wise, perhaps an infield prospect of some type and instead of Sierra, the Mets would likely want a pitching prospect that could immediately contribute like Drabek.

  16. Man, imagine the self-righteous moral outcry in the TO media (I’m looking at YOU Damien and Simmons) if the Jays signed Melky?

    It might be another reason why I’d like the idea of signing him.

  17. A knuckleballer would fit in quite nicely.

  18. It sucks that we can’t have internal access to the scouting reports to see how the team views other players, but this is part of their theory to acquiring players.

    Jays thinking: Well, we see this guy as a 70 power guy
    Other team thinking: We see him as a 55 power guy

    Jays know they view him differently and offer compensation in line with a 60 power guy and the other team makes the trade thinking they are doing well. The Jays trade lesser value than the future production of the new guy.

    The differing views on players is where the Jays think they can get a competitive advantage to line up more value. We can see that Francisco + draft pick didn’t equal Napoli two years + greater salary but this was more Texas picking our pocket on something they saw they could fix. It doesn’t mean it wasn’t the right deal for the Jays though that would have made him hit like that.

    This is the way this team operates now and I don’t know whether a big expenditure is even on the table for the team to consider. All of the small moves reinforce that- a million here a million there is on the table for sure but what about 15+ on a free agent? We haven’t crossed 5.5 million (free agent money) yet or something.

  19. I mean, I can’t believe it until I see it with regards to free agent dollars.

  20. Actually at this point I just want to hear something. Anything.*I haven’t seen a decent Jays rumour in a while.

    *As long as it’s not another ‘cheap controllable’ reliever. If I hear that again I think I’ll put a fist through the drywall.

    • I don’t think I’ve ever seen a woman put her fist through drywall*, so I’m kinda hoping for a cheap reliever interest rumor here.

      *May be due to not being married.

      • @indestructible-

        They only put their fists through drywall when you duck.

        ~~~Also-This is apparently not a good time to find anything close to humour in the situation. Forewarned is forearmed.

    • I feel the same, but to be fair, I don’t think much is going on at all with any MLB teams. If anything AA has been on the more active end thus far, with a few trades, small pickups, and a free agent signing. The winter meetings could end up being the make or break point of AA’s career, so it should be exciting, I doubt he goes home empty handed.

      • “…The winter meetings could end up being the make or break point of AA’s career…”
        I dunno how the hell JPR get 8 years and this is only AA’s 3rd? He’s made some amazing trades and had some crummy luck and invested heavily in a manager who was a rat.

        • +1000 to Carl Sagan.

          He’s already done a lot more than JPR ever did and in much more difficult circumstances. Fasshole would have fooled anyone I think. He looked and quacked like the real deal and had excellent credentials. I think as long as he doesn’t hire someone whose dream job is somewhere else and quits after the first year again he’ll be ok. And the chances of that happening twice are not huge. I hope.

    • I’d like to put a fist through your drywall! :D

  21. It’s put up or shut up time for AA now

    • It may well be that Rogers needs a better salesman as GM, someone who can bring the ROI to the capital dollars required to Win this thing. Stop focusing on direct expense and bring the message of what the promised land brings to the organization. The ROI is real and shown on the spreadsheet, but what a WS means to Nadir Mohamid and Rogers overall will be a legacy of what happens with Good Coporate Governance, Vision, and the belief in the management team they put in place. This can’t happen without investment.
      If I’m Beeston, I would be lighting a fire under AA, do or die – now!

      • ROI if you know business spending to make money does not work like your suggesting. ROI is getting the most out of what you have and thats what Alex is trying to do. I believe he will spend when time is right but two starters , a second baseman and maybe a left fielder is too much in one offseason

        • It works exactly as I suggested Dwayne. There is more than one path to success. ROI can be achieved by spending, Detroit, Texas, Boston, NewYork, LAA all practise it. Sadly, you see ROI through AA’s vision. You are not to blame for it is all that you have known over the years

    • I dont think AA is close to being on the block at all. pretty sure rogers was sold on some kind of long term, 5+ year plan. the growing angst is all fan motivated by people who somehow expected AA would take the team out of the dark ages and into the playoffs within 3 years. it was never going to happen. AA is an intelligent, adaptable, young GM who has made his fair share of mistakes, but for whom the good far outweighs the bad. just let him do his thing. since we really dont know what the payroll situation is, its hard to blame him for a lack of activity in free agency. however, if we get into years 5-7 and his prospect pipeline turns out to be a failure, then we can start calling for his head. for now though, he still has my confidence.

      • AA is one bad move away from turning the Jays into a circus act. Blue Jay players have chased the last 2 coaches out of town. The lack of desipline on this team, bad decision making, and just plain poor character have us on the brink of sheer jokdam.
        The wrong choice in a coach may well result in AA’s rapid demise

  22. Roy Halladay will return to Toronto. Except his jersey will say Feldman, as in Scott Feldman who turned his career from nothing into something by breaking down and 100% emulating Halladay’s delivery. I’d take a Dickey trade for JPA, Sierra plus whatever Escobar could bring from a 3rd team, a Feldman sign plus a Melky sign and call it a fantastic offseason. Gose and Alvarez get to start in Buffalo to develop and D’arnaud likely as well. I liked what I saw in Hechavarria and our offence can carry one weak bat.

    • Works for me

    • why ditch Escobar? For years the Jays biggest need was a hitting shortstop. We have an above average one right now and if we say goodbye to Escobar it could be another five years before we see another one, unless Hech could ever match Escobar’s offense.

      I think his bat and defense is worth more to the club than what they would get back in return. He isn’t expensive, has years of control, and could repeat his 4.4 WAR from 2011. Even in 2012 he had a 2.5 WAR. In comparison Izturis had a 0.1 WAR in 2011.

      • He’s a piece that could be moved, but not at fire-sale prices of course. Tell the bottom-feeders to fuck off. Wait to see if someone who sees his value comes calling or keep him. It’s not now or never by any means.

  23. Stoeten:

    Seriously, change your fucking name to Buzz Killington.

    All you do is shit all over everything and spew out negative horse shit all day unless youre cheerleading as the head of the constantines fanclub (of which youre the only member).

    It seems like the only time youre positive about something is when it’s your own theory and even then, a positive outlook or theory from you seems to be like a needle in a haystack these days.

    I like some of your writing but for someone operating a Jays FAN site you never really seem to have anything nice or positive to say. I started coming on here for your brutally honest but true way of looking at things but now it seems that you have become so shit shocked and beaten down by the horrible mismanagement of this franchise that you are completely unwilling to speak in a positive light.

    Seriously,, go back to the old Stoeten, buck the fuck up man, have fun with this shit, stop being such a fucking negative fun sucker, stop trolling the posts, let people dream and have fun in here. If not, hand the fucking reigns to someone that will.

    • well let’s continue the Halladay and Votto maple boner theories then

    • The BanHammer must be in the shop…

      • Why should I be banned? Because Im telling him to lighten the fuck up?

        Im not in here starting shit and insulting people or trolling etc. Im participating in the conversations in a rational manner 95% of the time.

        If he wants to ban me for telling him to lighten up and for having poor taste in music, meh, go ahead.

        • No worries, Buck. That was as positive a negative review as I’ve heard. Your heart is obviously in the right place. Ed must have a bug up his bum, and Jimmy Bob is conflicted, what with his multiple identities, but it’s not my place to judge.
          However, I’m a little leery vis a vis your poor taste in music…

    • @Buck.

      I agree there is a lot of negativity on this site directed at non sabermetric fans.

      The key is no to take it too seriously.

      There seems to be a heated debate over whether AA has the financial ability to get a #1 pitcher or Ace.

      I can’t see Rogers letting AA bid 25 million a year for Zach Greinke.

      I can’t see AA giving up the farm system to the Rays for david price.

      It seems more likely that AA will try & get an innings eater or a young pitcher that can turn into a #1or #2.

  24. who the fuck is buzz K?
    Is he related to Dice K?
    or just special K?
    What say you,potatoes? Fuk this wine is good

    • Mr. fukstick–

      It’s good to be drinking copious amounts of wine in your good company, my friend. I had my two kids over for a tasty repast today, along with their better halves, and it made me remember much of what I’m thankful for.
      My feeble musings post season pale beside your fukstik rantings and ravings–I only hope you can keep it up (so to speak) both longitudinally & latitudinally. There is a price to be paid and it will be exacted, be sure of that!
      My good sir, don’t succumb to this willy nilly woe is me blathering that is currently very popular. It’s early days, don’t you know. Give AA a chance to impress us. There will be plenty of time later to castigate him, to eviscerate him, to cast him into the outer reaches of our distain, if need be. For now, please keep the faith.

      • SP agreed on the early part. Any FA worth his stuff would wait til after all the tires were kicked and the bids were in…Definitely after the winter meetings in Dec, maybe in the 2nd half of Dec, maybe January or early Feb. depending on the market for his services.

      • Yep…

        The sky is not falling. If it’s a shit show in June, then we can panic.

      • you got it. down deep i’m still hopeful we make giant strides this offseason. Now, for breakfast

  25. I would like the Jays to throw a little bit of cash around this off season however, I really I don’t think there is much out there that would make them contenders without spending like drunken sailors like the Dodgers.

    First off, is Greinke really an ace? He is great, no doubt. I would place him as a #1a starter, not an ace. Would he look great in a Jays uniform? Absolutely. But at what cost? For the Jays to convince him to sign over the LA’s, or Texas, they’d have to offer him Sabathia money. Would that really be worth it?

  26. It’s been getting a little snippy, reachy and far fetched on the comment board these days. No one more guilty than I.

    We need a win. Some of that “we got Colby Rasmus for just that!” kinda mojo. We need The Return of the Ninja First Blood – Part 2 – Port of Call – New Orleans to be thrown down!

    The Whos of Whoville need to rejoice.

  27. Rival exec: #BlueJays’ Anthopoulos targeting starting pitching, “itching” to make a trade.

    https://twitter.com/Ken_Rosenthal/status/268343951491219456

    • Hopefully Dickey is where he’s got his biggest itch, at least in terms of baseball lol

    • Rival exec: AA really wants to overpay to appease fairweather fans. #PelleyWannaBeABaller #Shotcaller #20inchblades

    • Yeah…if I’m A.A., I don’t think I like this ‘itching to make a trade’ line out there. Other GM’s are already trying to take you to the cleaners…don’t want them having this perception.

      • exactly. It’s one thing to “overpay” on a free agent as therein it only costs $$$ and a lot of those mistakes CAN be fixed even if it takes some hi-wire moves, but, overpaying on a trade and seeing tremendous results showing up on the other team for years to come is never fully remedied. Think of that stupid trade we made where we acquired Estaban Loiaza for Michael Young, who is still starring in Texas afetr 10 years. Loaiza helped us out for about 6 months or sending Quantrill to LA for Prokepec. BE careful in trades as they often cost a lot more than money which can be replaced. Future stars cannot

        • I think if he was itching so badly to overpay he would have made one already and we probably would have seen Latos or Gio here last year.

          That said, you’re bang on with the danger. I’d rather see a free agent contract look bad than make a Young trade or Sirokta trade for that matter.

          • I don’t think those kind of knee-jerk trades are in his nature so I’m not overly worried. I’m sure he’s got all the other GMs on speed-dial but I think that’s been the case since his first day on the job.

    • This is spin for when they do nothing all winter and fans are screaming in March. “Hey, we tried all offseason, we were itching to put something together even in November, but nobody offered us a deal we felt was right, so …”

  28. Shi Davidi getting a little frustrated by the lack of news on the managerial front:

    Shi Davidi ‏@ShiDavidi
    #Jays spring opener in Dunedin goes Feb. 24 vs Orioles. Presumably, they’ll have a manager by then.

    Myself I think it’s a good sign…

    I hope.

  29. Kiss that Dickey goodbye?

    Mark Simon ‏@msimonespn

    anyone know what this is about? RT @SNYtv: TOMORROW: Mets Hot Stove Special Report: R.A. Dickey Announcement at 6:30PM

  30. Well Scott bakers off the market a cheap number 4 flier

  31. Doesn’t sound like the Jays are in on Youk :( But lots of other teams are.

  32. AA itching to make a trade but Baker just went to the Cubs on a pretty paltry 5-ish million 1 year deal? Doesn’t make a ton of sense unless he’s really afraid of going anywhere near someone who’s had the words Tommy John linked to them recently.

    For the price of a Frasor/Lyon re-signing (ish) I thought Baker would have been an excellent end of rotation piece. He’s averaged almost 2 WAR per season and has decent peripherals. For the price the Cubs paid, seems like a good deal.

  33. also unless they make a trade, I have a feeling the free agency market will not pick up till after the rule 5 draft. baseball really should have pushed this date earlier.

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