Welcome to your Sunday afternoon Dickey watch / a liveblog of my family Christmas, live from beautiful Saugeen Shores, Ontario. Home of Ontario’s finest sunsets. There’s a chance that the Jays will end this afternoon with the reigning Cy Young winner on their roster, and a near guarantee that I’ll end this afternoon with Egg Nog in my digestive system.
#Mets silence may be #bluejays working on Dickey extension. They need that. Remember #expos & Langston ’89. Trade before extension – c-ya
— Richard Griffin (@RGriffinStar) December 16, 2012
Dickey Update: Looks like most of the updates today are going to be updates about how there aren’t any updates, but if you’re into reading between the lines it appears that this trade is making a transition from NY media style where every offer and detail is leaked immediately, to TO media style where nobody tells you anything until it’s done.
Family Christmas Update: I have arrived at my Mom`s house. A lot of my Aunts and Uncles are here already and I have been reminded that I`ve lost quite a bit of hair in the last 12 months. Great start to the Sunday, guys.
If you haven’t checked Fangraphs today (why are you reading about baseball on the internet if you aren’t checking fangraphs, nerd?) and need to be calmed down a little bit due to the package coming back and everyone asking you how this trade is different from the Royals overpaying for Shields, the great David Cameron has two articles up about it. First about debunking Dickey as a one-year wonder, and a second that is a reassuring opinion that this is the best possible time for the Jays to be going for it. Both make for good reading and should simmer your nerves a little.
Family Christmas Update: We have those plastic champagne glasses that your office buys at the dollar store when you have to work on New Years Eve, except ours are full of salsa. I’m digging it.
Sense got is that all parties do not sign off on this tonite, maybe not even tomorrow. My best GUESS is Monday. #Mets #Bluejays — Joel Sherman (@Joelsherman1) December 16, 2012
Oh, cool Joel Sherman. That’s fine. I don’t have anything important to do anyway. I’m going to keep telling my family that this is important so I don’t have to field questions about being single. (Those two things aren’t related at all, are they?)
Family Christmas Update: We have our first sighting of a significant other making their inagural “Meet the family” visit, in the form of my cousin Jessica’s new boyfriend Jeff. Jeff is in over his head. Just keep your head down and don’t get in between me and the shrimp ring, rookie.
Everyone worry about Travis d’Arnaud’s knee: Don’t. Club source says Mets looked at his medicals and they were just fine. — Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) December 16, 2012
Don’t fool yourselves, guys. If we trade d’Arnaud his leg is going to explode like Buck Martinez blocking home plate to turn a double play. And JPA is going to raise his OBP by like 75 points.
Family Christmas Update: I have been discovered by my fellow cousins in the upstairs rec room. Football and small talk. I bribed my niece with candy to go downstairs and score me more shrimp. Keep your eyes on me if you want to learn, Jeff.
Evaluators around MLB are beyond shocked TOR is talking about trading Travis d’Arnaud for a player with one year on his contract, Dickey. — Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) December 16, 2012
The broad perception in the industry is that if the Mets pull this discussed Dickey deal for d’Arnaud, it’s an incredible trade for them.
— Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) December 16, 2012
Don’t twist “Good trade for the Mets” to mean “Bad trade for the Jays”, but if you think about how high we all have been on d’Arnaud and Syndergaard since we learned to spell their names you can understand why the general consensus is that the Mets are doing well to get maximum value on their incredibly low-risk investment of bringing in Dickey in the first place. You could do a lot worse for a guy you’ve only paid $5 million a year.
Family Christmas Update: My brother-in-law is selling his car. It’s a 2006 Honda Civic SI. 117,000 km, manual transmission, never in an accident. If you’re in the KW area you should check it out.
Sources: #Mets, #BlueJays have agreement in principle on Dickey trade. Window open for Jays to extend Dickey, which would complete deal.
— Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) December 16, 2012
OH BOY OH BOY OH BOY
Negotiating window for Dickey extension is 72 hours, expiring Tuesday at 2 pm ET. #Mets #BlueJays
— Ken Rosenthal (@Ken_Rosenthal) December 16, 2012
YOU GUYS!!!
Family Christmas Update: Smorgasbord style lunch. The turkey is off the hook. Like whoa. What a great 10 minutes. My Mom just made a nice speech about family, it was moving. DICKEY!
#angels would have to eat “almost all” the $42M thru ’14 on vernon wells for yanks to take him. nothing close yet.
— Jon Heyman (@JonHeymanCBS) December 16, 2012
I know that has nothing to do with Dickey but could you imagine if the Yankees got Vernon Wells? Could anything possibly be funnier than that? Instead of booing him we could all just laugh collectively every time he’s up, swinging through high fastballs and popping up first pitch strikes.
Family Christmas Update: I have been banished to the basement. I was distracting everyone by having a laptop in front of me and literally half of my family has been talking about Dickey for the last 10 minutes. SORRY I’M A PROFESSIONAL, MOM. Whoa, I’m literally blogging from my Mom’s basement right now. Such a stereotype. Shameful.
Confirming @ken_rosenthal report. Dickey deal is done if he signs an extension. Got until Tuesday afternoon. Jays paying a huge price.
— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) December 16, 2012
So this is happening. It really is happening.
Family Christmas Update: Cousins and brothers-in-law have discovered me in the basement. People who don’t come here much are just realizing that there’s a whole room full of beer and an HDTV down here and that it’s secretly my favourite part of the house. My Mom’s macaroni casserole is as good as ever. Really need to figure out what she does different because I can’t quite get it the same when I try to make it.
@archizuber We need a Jef update. A Jeffdate.
— Brian K (@Briligerent) December 16, 2012
Right before my Mom’s speech, Jeff turned to my sister’s husband and jokingly said “Let’s hear a speech, Avis.” which was met with a chorus of “Watch it, new blood. You need 5 years tenure and a pledge of long-term commitment before you’re allowed to crack jokes.” My cousin Emily’s boyfriend Chris laughed and nodded because this is his 4th year and they are engaged. Looking forward to seeing what he brings to the table in 2013.
As @nypost_mets first reported: R.A. Dickey, Josh Thole and prospect for Travis d’Arnaud, Noah Syndergaard, John Buck and prospect.
— Jeff Passan (@JeffPassan) December 16, 2012
We obviously don’t know who either “Prospect” is, but you can probably assume it’s nobody of note or they’d include that name too.
Family Christmas Update: Lunch is over and the nieces and nephews have come down here because this is where all the toys are. I’m watching kids play with my old toys. It wouldn’t be a big deal, but like… They aren’t making the right noise for some of the cars. I’ll do my best to block it out. My niece Camryn says hi.
Blue Jays and Dickey have begun discussing a contract extension, according to a league official
— Andy Martino (@MartinoNYDN) December 16, 2012
I knew this would happen while today. I just knew it.
Family Christmas Update: My newphew Noah was looking for markers so he could do some colouring. I told him to go upstairs to ask my Mom if he was allowed and get me a beer in the process. I knew he was allowed to use the markers, I just wanted a beer. I’m very good at being an Uncle.
confirming @ken_rosenthal report, jays and mets have agreed on players. jays have 3-day window to do RA extension
— Jon Heyman (@JonHeymanCBS) December 16, 2012
Blue Jays continue to negotiate with Bo McKinnis on extension for Dickey and price for Toronto higher than it was going to be for Mets
— JIM BOWDEN (@JimBowdenESPNxm) December 16, 2012
Seems like Dickey is fully aware that that team is owned by some rich motherfuckers. This could be a long process.
Family Christmas Update: Everyone wants to know about Jeff, so I feel obligated to let you know that Jeff has located an acoustic guitar. He’s one of the people that knows how to strum and slap the sides at the same time to make rhythm with the body of the guitar. Needless to say this is an incredibly risky move so early on. Jeff has 80 Want. We are all Jeff.
Any chance at all Dickey could remain a Met if TOR talks don’t go well. “We’re past that point,” one Mets person said.
— Andy Martino (@MartinoNYDN) December 16, 2012
So it looks like no matter what, RA Dickey is going to be playing elsewhere in 2013. That gives me some measure of confidence that this deal will be done fairly quickly. Regardless of how much the proposed price is raised from the 2/$26 the Mets refused to give, it seems likely that it’ll be a pretty good deal for a Cy Young winner.
Family Christmas Update: We have our first crying kid at 3:30pm. Chris and Jeff taking turns playing guitar now. Seems like Chris isn’t going to let the 4 years of work he’s done sitting quietly at family gatherings get shown up by some new guy who slaps the side to make rhythm. I’m not picking a side. Chris is a proven entity, and Jeff is still showcasing new tools and potential.
Dickey has a 1.72 ERA indoors the past three years, for what it’s worth, via @anthonydicomo
— Jon Heyman (@JonHeymanCBS) December 16, 2012
Feel good about that, everyone. Read it twice if you have to.
Family Christmas Update: This is the last one from me, I’ve got to shut the laptop down and get back into a car soon and get back to the city. It was nice to come back home and see my family, or at least I assume it would have been if I actually spoke to anyone about anything other than this trade. I guess what I meant to say was it was nice to use a different computer for a while.
Winning the division is a huge deal too. How much would it suck to win one of the wildcards with 95 wins and then end up losing the one game playoff. Or even just using a good pitcher in a must win before a 5 game series. Dickey gives them an extra edge.
Too true.
Can someone compare what we’re giving up for Dickie to what the Phillies gave us for Roy? I have a horrible memory, but it seems like we’re giving more. And that ain’t right.
When mets traded for Johan Santana we gave up 4 “big time” prospects. I can tell you, no of them are big time major leaguers right now.. Hopefully trade woks out for both this time
Wasnt Angel Pagan involved in that deal?
what are we giving up? did AA call you and give you the inside information that NO ONE else has??
Everyone reporting same thing: dickey for the mother load + 5mil cash. Don’t understand the 5mil though.
wont believe it until I see it
The money being sent is probably just the cash Miami sent along with Buck being shipped along with him.
god, you’re dull.
This trade is awesome, finally we have a winner! Sabermetics yourself to death you hand wringers of worry. The Blue Jays are now contenders for the WS in 2013. Stop the belly aching and get on board the AA express to the 2013 WS
If this deal is as advertised, it is certainly demonstrates how expensive quality starting pitching has been this offseason.
Meanwhile, in Texas, Jon Daniels is still lurking around his office, looking for his balls.
Agree with bird, dickey will win 17 games this year
Jays timed it perfect with Yankees and sox in the toilet
Dave Cameron’s conclusion:
The price still looks steep. There’s no question that Toronto is giving up some valuable assets in this trade, and will likely regret this move in the long term if they don’t win in 2013. But, by being aggressive in pursuing upgrades before making this kind of future-for-now swap, the Blue Jays have made it more likely that the whole series of moves results in a playoff run. And that’s what makes these kinds of moves worth it.
The problem is that Cameron doesn’t address the weakness in the AL East and the fact that the Jays still have a farm system that has many future stars in the game. Cameron is like most statistisians very pessimistic, and unable to understand that this game is still won and lost on the emotions in the moment.
‘dawg, when you’re right, you’re right.
(It just happens so seldom, you know?)
Let the magical season of 2013 begin!
Spud this is a magical monent in BJ history
@birdawg
Agreed. I realize that AA has been given the payroll parameters & keys to the prospect cupboard to to build a solid world series contender in 2013.
The Jays need to win the division to guarantee a few home playoff games.
I think Stoeten will have to bring on Archi fulltime to keep up with the daily post requirements.
No more weekend games off for Stoeten.
Every Jays loss will be dissected . I expect 500 comments plus per game.
I love the family updates Archie. Keep them coming!
The downside with all the moves is that all the raving lunatics will cry about the world coming to an end with each loss. Never mind a two or three game losing streak. At that point every negative Nancy will be pouring out of the woodwork to shout “I told you so” from the top of their lungs. Unfortunately, it’s something we all better get used to. Things were no different back in the late 80′s and early 90′s.
Dunno. The way I’ remember the WS seasons was laughing the entire time at how much better we were than everybody else. I might be misremembering though
Well either negative Nancys or nattering nabobs of negativism…place is lousy with them.
I do love me a Spiro Agnew reference, Carl.
Anagram of Spiro Agnew…’I grow a penis’…thank you to humour writer Dave Barry for highlighting this many years ago.
Well, I’m off to read the TSN comments on this trade.
Wish me luck…
How close is syndergaard to being ready for majors?
And how good is this Kevin pillar prospect. He’s rumored to be the unnamed 4th player coming to mets.
You’re getting good at this, Nicky smooth.
You should join BlueJayWay over on the TSN board. You would increase each other’s enjoyment.
Noah – 2+ seasons
Pillar – absolutely positively stunningly god awful
Reading the TSN commenters is the best.
Here’s one gem:
“… dickey brings one thing there was no way we were getting from d’arnaud and syndergaard this year and that’s fiery competitiveness, veteran presence and work ethic…”
With an astounding +21
get this man where he belongs, in the broadcast booth with Tabby and Buck
I bet it was one of them that left the comment.
Did anyone see the video of Tim Kurkjian on the TSN site? To sum it up: “Veteran’s are very important to have.”
NM
it wasnt the term “veteran presence” that gave it away was it?
does he bring ‘grit, hustle, and determination’ as well? Fuuuuuuuuuck…
As far as AL rotation goes, is it fair to put Toronto in the 1st tier with Detroit and Tampa Bay?
For all the worries about the Jays’ battered rotation coming into the offseason, the top 5 made 148 starts last year:
Dickey(33), Romero (32), Johnson (31), Buehrle (31) & Morrow (21)
How awesome would it be if the Jays only had to rely on Happ, Jenkins & maybe Nolin & McGuire for 14 starts.
Small, You gotta realize I hate the damn Yankees. I’m routing for my boy Reyes to have 30 triples up there on the carpet and dickey to win another 20. Jays win the AL east and ill be crackin molson’s just like you.
That’s a good stat for people to think about. That’s 91.3 % of all starts. Those are Tampa type numbers.
Even better is that while there’s probably no true ace there in the Verlander mould, at least for right now, there’s 3 guys for sure in Dickey, Johnson and Morrow that easily match up with him in a single game or a short series. Not many teams can say that. Marry that ability to the Jays offense and this team’s odds are looking pretty good.
I imagine there will still be money for one more reliever too.
WHAT ABOUT MCGOWAN?!
This is _literally_ the best thing I’ve ever read.
As I recall one of the concerns with a knuckelballer was how the indoor game would affect the pitcher. Candiotti preferred it as the outdoor elements would at times be a hinderence
He threw a 1 hitter in Tampa this year and it was the nastiest knuckle he ever had that day. Made longoria look like a silly little bitch
I’m pretty sure it’s there’s no real debate – knucklers are better indoors.
Re “it’s there’s” – bow down to my syntax.
I don’t think AA would be giving up Syndy and D’arnaud for Dickey…Buck and Thole are basically a wash. All the leaks have been coming from the NY media…they are bound to exaggerate their own side of the trade. I think many ppl in NY are going to be pissed off when the deal is officially announced.
This deal is confirmed man, you gotta wrap your head around that fact that the jays are pushing all thecips in the pot. I’d be friggin excited if I was a jays fan. You just got the reigning cy young dude!!!
A cy young with an un-hittable pitch!!! For a few prospects and some cash??? That’s a steal.
A deal is confirmed, but the players aren’t yet.
Pretty safe to say its TDA and probably Buck, Thole and Synder like most are reporting.
The other two prospects are anyone’s guess at this point.
If it was Pillar and Familia I would feel a lot better about this deal. Either way I’m still pretty cool with it.
It’s kind of surreal that we were tossing this idea around for a month and now it’s happening. Same with the Melky signing.
this.
I just named my daughters cat Dickey and sprinkled rum on it. My work is done here.
Probably not the first time your dick’s been christened with rum, you pirate you.
this made me laff
I recommend following in Spuds footsteps. I just finished watching Knuckleball and those 90 minutes have made me into a complete fanboy. Take all the prospects!!!1!1
Thankee MaxPower417, although it’s a little late in life to become a trent-setter.
And yes, you got it, my man-crush on RA increased exponentially upon viewing “Knuckleball.”
I watched it too. I realized for the first time that some players on the Red Sox actually have souls.
you mean we don’t call them the Sux because they’re all vampires?
I would take Bobby Parnell over a prospect I think depending on the prospect I guess. Parnell is signed cheap until 2016, he had the MLB record for hardest pitch until 2011 (102.5) and routinely throws 96-99 with decent secondary stuff.
Prospect wise I think expecting anything in their top 5 is out of the question, 5-10 is iffy but reality wise I think we can expect something between 10-20 and with the lack of infield prospects in the organization I think we are looking at someone like Reese Havens, Jefry Marte or Danny Muno.
Those bitching about the trade please stop and LOOK at this fucking team… the only need now is maybe another bullpen arm which could be Parnell but if not I think AA should really look into Brian Wilson or perhaps as a fall back guys like Kyle Farnsworth, Brandon Lyon, mayyyybe Todd Coffey (minor league contract). But the pen does need a proven arm down there and if AA has gone this far… why not go all out and get Wilson.
Well you’re not getting Parnell for the very reason you mentioned, he’s cheap until 2016 and that’s what the next couple of Mets teams will be all about.
If jays include Kevin pillar as the 4th player in deal then I think mets would throw in Parnell. Bobby 100 as we like to cal him
If parnell is included I would think Pillar or DJ Davis would be coming to mets cause we are looking for young outfielders.
dj cant be traded, like your thinking though!
DJ is our #5 prospect. I doubt the Jays would bounce #1, 3 & 5 in the same deal.
I’m hoping it’s Pillar and Familia. Familia could still potentially slot in the rotation next year and be a bullpen piece like Parnell this year.
Or we’ll take Nimmo.
We still got a lot of pitching on the farm.
Nicky: From a Mets perspective, what’s the thought on Nimmo?
@Dexter
Familia & Pillar would fit the “non-elite” part, though Familia is still pretty solid.
MLB.com has him as a top 100 prospect and he would likely be part of the AAA depth with Jenkins.
How is Parnell a prospect?? He’s got 250 games in the majors over 5 years. Keep dreaming.
Are you retarded? re-read what I said you moron.
I would take him OVER a prospect you dildo
Was I talking to you fucktard? I was replying to Nicky. Is your head up your ass too like Gary that you can’t follow the thread?
Yah I gathered that later, chalk it up to being tired and reading way too much DJF and MLBTR this weekend
@Buck–
My problem is, you say “why not go all out?”
Earlier, someone said “you’re not all in until you’re all in” (or words to that effect.)
Where does it end?
Ok… RESPONSIBLY all in not YANKEES all in lol
Fair explanation?
or Dodgers all in I suppose would be the better explanation.
Hey Spud,
That was me that said that. I would say the Jays are pretty close to all in at this point. We don’t need all stars throughout the lineup. I think moving Happ into the swingman role on the rotation addressed what I think was the last major issue on the team.
Would I like another bullpen piece or a bat to platoon with Lind? Sure, but at this point I’m pretty happy with where the Jays are at going into the 2013 season.
To continue with the poker analogy… you don’t need 4 aces to go all in; 2 pairs might get the job done.
In Rosenthal’s new article he says:
I liked the Royals’ trade because they acquired 40 percent of their 2013 rotation without giving up a single major leaguer. I’ve had a more difficult time coming around to the Jays’ deal. But I get it, and I applaud it. In fact, I’m starting to love it.
I guess at his age it takes longer to get excited. Someone should tell him there are pills for that.
As a concession to Stoeten, I will recommend to the Jays that the Opening Day National Anthems be replaced by Psy singing Gangnam Style
Oh yeah and a free beer to the first 20,000 fans
Only have seen a few nimmo at-bats on YouTube. He looks raw but they say high ceiling. Mets minor league blog seems to like him but problem too early to tell
The Mets #4 prospect isnt going to happen fellas…
WIN…
For all you people bitching about what they’re giving up, you will not be thinking about that if you are rampaging up Yonge Street in October, getting to participate in one of those extremely rare moments where everybody loves each other. You will be high fiving people you would otherwise be worried were going to roll you for your Jordans.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that if you weren’t around for ’92 and ’93, your opinion re the Blue Jays in not valid and won’t ever be. Objectively.
I think Parnell makes the most sense since he can help you guys right now. Power arm out of the pen. DJ Davis is land locked for years with Joey bats, Rasmus, etc etc etc
Might as well send me over in the deal and take bobby 100
That’s ageist! That’s like saying RADAR’s opinion on women isn’t valid because he hasn’t had an erection since ’92 or ’93!
That’s not what the nurses who give him sponge baths say.
+1. I had just moved to Toronto in August 1993. I could see the parade from my downtown appartment.
I remember visiting a store on yonge street across from eaton centre where they were selling world series merchandise .
It looks like 2013 will be a magical year like 1993.
AA has built a juggernaut for next year. The team should do well even if 1 or 2 of the starting rotation gets hurt.
Furthermore, the cost of acquiring any other free agents will go down , since players interested in “winning” will wantto come to the jays.
The downside is that the line at the concession stands will be getting longer with all the new fans.
Can’t wait for opening day.
Star One Tickets is selling home opener tickets at $160 for section 118 where I usually sit.
Wow!
Awwwwwechieeeeeeee! You’re a beauty, refreshing and funny, look forward to slamming a 16 dollar Rogers beer with you some day. Jeffs buying, and if he doesn’t we will bring him down to Gibbys office dressed in a Hillenbrand jersey.
How many posts have there been the last few days. Is it a record for djf?
Brent, jays sold the farm. Didn’t you hear?
All for wonderful new bride. She’s 39 years old, hairy, and performs magic. It’s a marriage made in heaven..
The winter meetings the past couple years have been nuts. I can’t say before that because it was last years winter meetings coverage that got me hooked on this site.
So is it confirmed that both d’Arnaud and Snygen are going to NY?
King D’arnaud
Syndergreat
Uncle buck
And
Rumored to be DJ jazzy Davis
Where did you hear DJ Davis? Haven’t seen that anywhere reputable. He’s also no allowed to be traded until July. I really doubt that the package.
Guess we’re all in now…
Lets just give them sanchez, nolin, osuna, norris, gose, and call it a day.
after all, after reading all these posts… i gues we are
“all in”
which makes no sense to me. does “all in” mean doing dumb shit?
It’s a gambling saying, pretty much putting it all on the line.
nothing is confirmed yet…deal might fall apart if Dickie decides to get greedy
RA dickey is probably the least greedy person to ever play in the majors.
he doesn’t have to be greedy. he just might not want to play in TDot and raise his asking price…start the season, get dealt either at the deadline, or play it out and sign where he wants. someone is going to pay him alot of money.
and the last part of the deal has to be in our favor even though insignificant to offset this return. guaranteed AA expanded the prospect swap to compensate
I’ve had a feeling from the start that it will be bobby parnell
I’m fucking stoked.
I’m fucking stoned.
I am stoked and stoned.
(actually not yet)
I’d rather have the “k”, but to each his own. The Mets did alright today.
I’m Canadian, so I’m only pleasantly inebriated.
+5%
canada is the marijuana capital of the world. not holland, not jamaica, it’s canada.
isn’t the whole american beer thing a myth? they measure by volume and we by something else or vice versa?
I’m pretty sure it’s a myth.
So let’s rate the impact factors for our shiny new toys:
1. Dickey – I imagine he will be the opening day starter. If he keeps performing at his pace then the trade will end up being a very good move. He will be expected to be a guy that can put together an 8 or 9 inning quality start in the playoffs. This is the first guy we have had since Halladay that we can expect to see a number complete games from, and he seems to be in his prime.
2. Johnson – He said he pitched terribly in 2012, but that season was still better than the majority of the Jays’ pitching staffs performances over the last few years. Given he is a full year removed from surgery, Johnson is more likely to find his stride in 2013, and if he does, he could probably be the ace on 2/3rds or more of MLB rosters.
3. Reyes – Probably the most complete and consistent infielder the Jays have had since Alomar. High OBP with plus defense and speed are things that any team always needs.
4. Cabera – Another guy who is in his prime years. The number of switch hitters on the Jays will be deadly, and with Reyes and Cabrera at the top of the order, Jose and co. will rack up RBIs like they have never done before. Again like Reyes, high OBP and plus defense are welcome on any major league club. How much did extra testosterone affect Melky’s game in 2012? tough to know, but he could very well be the best signing of the off season.
5. Buehrle – Exactly what the Jays needed last year. Consistent and steady, and he pitches a shitload of innings. Hopefully he transitions well to the AL east, but he has been an American league guy for almost his whole career, and the other offenses in the AL east have never been weaker. He makes a lot of money, but so what? Keep this guy around and more likely than not he will do what he has always done.
6. Bonifacio – A more important pickup then we might realize. In 2011 he performed like an everyday player and can play at almost any position. If any position player misses a lot of games, Bonifacio could fill in without much of a drop off in production. He will also push Izturis for the 2B job and provides speed. And awesome, yet another switch hitter.
7. Izturis – He is sort of like a poor man’s Scutaro, but with better speed and he is a switch hitter. He provides much needed infield depth and is a piece that will be necessary if this team wants to go far.
8. Thole (or Buck?) – either one of these guys has played a lot of games over the last two years and are more than competent backups. Again, they are depth that is needed on a team looking for a championship.
also I hope that Parnell’s name can be added to this list within 48 hours. He would probably fit in at around 6th or 7th on this list, be he fills one of the few needs the team still has which is a quality bullpen arm.
Well that was fun…nothing like a good rumor/trade to drop life and stayed glued to the computer for the last 40/48hrs. 10x better than the Darvish debacle a year ago.
Since I had to leave for real food, I come back to see that postings have slowed from 4.8/min to <1. There has been alot of sensible comments in the last couple of hours and while I'm not gonna slag those yelling 'we were fleeced' as most of them make up/will make up the majority in the seats come April-October! Jump aboard the winning train bitches! you can get on and off all you want, everyone welcome. Asses in seats=JJ extension!
But holy fucking shitballs of shitstorms….there is a shitstorm brewing boys and girls (wtf Karen you Buckmartinezhairswoosh now?). Sure giving away the #1&3 prospects in a top 5 system hurts alot but we now have a legitimate kickass rotation. I can't imagine the fucking backlash if the massholes traded for Dickey. It would be the same old FUCK AA and Rogers we've heard for the last year. Of course nothing is won now and we could end up playing a one gamer with the Orioles for all I know but this puts us in a pretty good position to compete NOW and likely for the next 3-4years.
And as its been said above me and likely much better, the time is NOW. AA was all-in after the 'Mathis' trade. So this is maybe an over-pay but I wouldn't call it a massive over-pay. We are getting back a reigning fucking CY Young winner not some above-average/good potential 4 year control pitcher. Sure the King or 1/2 dozen other pitchers
could have/might have been available but FUCK we have a mainly proven top of the rotation pitcher and I have to believe due diligence was taken…in AA we Trust (TM.)
And as Buck Martinez hair swoosh said above me lets start cheering for this team instead of shitting on JPA's obp etc., how many other #9 hitters can jack 20-30/year. Sure it's painful sometimes and his tweeting is borderline obnoxious but THE FUCK.
But whatever…it was very painful watching him flailing at hundreds of shitballs last year. Its hard not to shit on bad plays/players and with the team that we fielded most of last year it pretty easy to do alot of pissing and moaning (still laughing at Thames' diving at balls 10 feet away from him)
For all the TSN/jackass commentators who made it over here for the weekend, when you are lying on Young street slouched over in a puddle of your own piss and vomit in October I'll flip you a lonnie.
And a shout out to Archie! Thanks for the afternoon updates, much enjoyed.
Amen on cheering for this team. If everything breaks right, the starting rotation alone could be worth 20 WAR. Insane.
Not sure why you involved my name in the shitstorm portion of your hurrah rant. Care to explain?
@BMHS your post at 34et re:cheer don’t shit on jpa/team. I thought you had summed it up decent. I guess it was a moment of weakness after reading the first 176 post mainly shitting on the trade or the pints of captains&ginger.
After reading some of you subsequent posts and remembering you were the head cheerleader on the FUCK Rogers bandwagon…a big FUCK you to U! Go back to using your other handle…famous guy.
–
• FamousAmazingGuy says:
07.17.12 @ 9:53 PM EDT
Reply
not sure why they’re burning coco in a low leverage situation?
For starters who calls it a handle anymore, are we in 2002? hehe
Secondly I am really not sure what youre trying to say here, one minute you are praising something I say and the next you are saying “Fuck U” Sorry Im not following, its been a long weekend of browsing.
Now… yes this past summer I was absolutely frustrated with Rogers and AA. So was probably 70% of the fans plus the players on the team. But I am glad now that he didnt do anything during the season because there was just no fix for the gaping hole caused by injuries.
However that being said, I think AA sensed that the players and fans needed him to make moves, be it trading assets like Bautista and the other stars to rebuild the team or a mix of trading prospects and responsible signings which is what he did. Rogers opened the wallet and let AA go to work thank god.
I like the Dickey trade so I am really not sure what your issue is here with me or my posts. Sure, the price paid was hefty but Ive been the one trying to tell people that as Jays fans weve been a little bit spoiled. Wells contract gone for nothing, Lawrie for nothing, Rasmus for nothing, Johnson, Buerhle, Reyes, Buck and Bonifacio for near nothing and now it comes time to get Dickey a Cy Young award winner and the jays had to pay a bit to get him but its fair value for the skill and he also completes a fucking amazing looking rotation.
No more will all of us have to groan and moan about the starting pitcher 3 out of every 5 games like in times past. Now we as fans know that every single game the Jays are sending someone skilled and capable of great things to the hill. That mixed with great offense, great defense, a solid bullpen and good looking bench players will make the Jays actually FUN and exciting to watch this summer.
So…. that all being said,,, thanks AA and sorry I ever doubted you sir.
Look, I got to admit you make some valid points especially about the rotation. Yeah I saw myself in there as of the 8 games I went to last year, Morrow did not start any of them and I saw them win once. Fukin depressing is right. Drabek (2) gone by the fifth inning in both starts and already 10pm, Alvarez(3) used for BP even in the game against the pathetic Mets, Hutchinson (1), Meh, and Romero(2), one start was OK I guess but the second wasn;t and by eoy I had no confidence in him at all ( along with many others). This year he projectsas a 5 and I hope he bounces back , but if not, we have Happ, and I still think there is a chance AA brings back CV, either as depth or so he can trade Happ. Good post
A little bit of nails on Thole and Dickey.
“As such, I expected the Mets would choose to retain Thole, especially if the Mets retain R.A. Dickey for 2013. Dickey has touted Thole’s ability to catch the knuckleball, and gave Thole much of the credit for his phenomenal year after the season ended. Thole does add value from that standpoint – he knows Dickey, has more experience catching Dickey than anyone else in the league and, despite the high passed ball total (most catchers who are responsible for catching knuckleballers lead the league in passed balls), Thole has learned to handle the knuckleball over the last three years or so.”
And a hat tip to AA and the Jays scouting dept. for getting Thole in the deal if his impact, even on Dickey’s confidence, is as great as indicated in the snip I quoted.
And a Cap tip to Stoetsy
If we’re giving up our top prospects throw in Sanchez and get David Price. Would feel a-lot better than this deal. Sorry!
You would feel better paying a guy thats been injured a shit load and hasnt had a winning season since his rookie year 17-18 million dollars?
Wait my mistake…. I re-read and it made more sense lol sorry
Sanchez, d’Arnaud, and Syndergaard don’t get you Price. Especially within the divison. Another prospect of that caliber might get you him in the national league, but within the division it would cost another significant piece or two. Also it looks like the Jays will have Dickey for the next 4 years, whereas Price will become a free agent before then. We also know Price will cost more than Greinke on the open market. It is also not ridiculous to think that Dickey could match Price’s performance, or at least come close to it, in 2013.
Pffft, I wouldnt. I feel comfortable knowing our prospects are going to the National league and not the same division. Plus we have 2 lefties, adding a knuckleballer in a dome setting is strategically more logical. Righty, lefty, righty, lefty, knuckleballer. Checkmate, lay the fawkin red carpet out.
One added bonus of getting Dickey is that we get to remove one left hander from the rotation. Some teams like Boston were looking especially deadly vs LHP going into 2013. One less LH starter vs teams like that should definitely make things easier. Right off the bat they were looking at potentially having two of them face Boston in the first series.
That’s a good point, especially when there may be a need for a lefty in the bullpen.
the BIGGEST problem with this trade is…that its DECEMBER! we have to wait over 3 months now
I want someone to put me in sci-fi style cryo stasis until the season starts…
for sure AA purs a forth year team option in this deal too
If the deal is right, I love it as a Mets fan. But I really think it’s a win-win. I have read your guys posts on here, and I think some of you have a tough time giving up so much because you are so used to having tons of prospects and not going all out after a WS. But the Jays are in a great position of having the usual Goliaths in the AL East both down a bit. Now is absolutely the time you guys have to go All in. Backing out of a deal that nets you a star pitcher just because you are worried about your future could cost you the best chance you’ve had at a WS in a long time. I think it’s a great move for you guys, and one the Mets had to do.
As far as RA, im sure some of your fans are well informed, you all probably know he is a stud. 3 REALLY good seasons with the Mets, he doesn’t walk anyone. Throws an 80mph knuckle ball, that he can control. He has said before that he has the ability to hit spots, inside/outside corners, up and down in the zone, something unheard of for knuckle ball pitchers. He also probably has the best pickoff move of any right hander in baseball(9 pickoffs in the last 2 seasons), doesn’t allow SB, and plays a Gold Glove caliber defense.
His biggest weakness is rain. You guys play your home games in a dome, so that is no worry, but road games on the road, you manager will have to work your rotation around weather reports when needed. He is terrible in the rain. Flat out. Outside of that, he is great. He works hard and I have no doubt he will probably become your fan favorite pretty quick.
I know the Mets arent making the playoffs in 2013 so you bet I’ll be rooting for the Blue Jays in the WS if you guys can get there, so good luck to you guys!
Thanks for the post! I hope our guys help you out as much as I think Dickey will help us!
My pearl jam fan club # is 20,014. Beat that..
sure beats 317 XXX
Only good for 12 th row at MSG, I’d be front and center at the Rodgers
How does Dickey manage to keep runners from stealing? It seems like when he throws his slower knuckle balls it would be relatively easy to steal a base, especially if the catcher fumbles the pitch for even a moment.
He has an outstanding pickoff move, including one to 2nd base that’s unlike any other pitchers.
Here’s a vid of him doing it — against the Marlins, LOL — if this blogfeed will let me post a link:
Dickey picks off runner at second
If the catcher fumbles a pitch, it’s a passed ball, so obviously that does happen but doesn’t count against Dickey’s SB numbers. But he picks off a lot of runners and has an insanely quick move to 1st base. Also, a move to 2nd that has worked as well. You guys will see it. He doesn’t look all that athletic, but he fields his position really well and is pretty quick off the mound. He definitely isn’t your typical knuckle baller.
Thanks for the extra insight MF12123. I can’t bring myself to read the mlb.com comments. Gotta a good Mets blog I can continue my fix on?
Metsblog.com is ok, but we have some crazies on there like anyone. Ill be on there on and off tonight and if any Jays fans ask any questions about our guys Im always good to answer them.
Metsfan12123- keep an eye on the boyswe sent back, they will be something special. Especially the big Texan. Best of luck next year.
There’s an entire page on Baseball Prospectus about Dickey holding runners on/picking them off complete with some great animated GIFs.
Thanks for the post…
I have never ever given a fuck about the Mets but seeing the Mets succeed and the Yankees struggling will be incredible in 2 years or so. After looking through the Mets farm system and upcoming talent, there’s some really great ball players on their way up. Mix that with the pieces in place now and youre laughing. The Yankees in two years will be without pretty much everyone taking the field for them this season. That will be glorious.
I remember seeing Ra Dickey pitch on TV when he was with the Twins and thinking “jeez if this guy ever really gets it together he’s going to be something” In fact since then Ive always traded for him in video game baseball… looks like this year I wont have to lol
Sure it sucks getting rid of two guys that myself and other fans are excited about but honestly… with all the savage deals AA has wheeled in his tenure, I think the Jays can stand to lose a couple prospects for a cy young winner.
Good luck!
Thanks for the post! I’ve always liked the Mets (probably because I hate the Yankees so much).
I really can’t believe the Mets got more for Dickey and whoever else is coming with him than the Marlins got for Reyes, Buehrle, Johnson, Bonifacio, and Buck, so congrats there.
For Miami the trade was more about unloading big contracts, filling holes and adding a few prospects. The NY trade is about getting as much value for Dickey as possible. You can’t even begin to compare the two.
you’d think that if Miami held a proper fire sale they might’ve been able to get a lot more for Reyes all by himself, and maybe package Johnson and Buehrle for something good too. who knows.
Random Dickey trivia – out of the current Blue Jays roster, who has had the most career success against him, with 3 hits, 2 homeruns and 7 RBI in 10 at bats?
J.bats
Gotta be Buck.
Adam Lind.
Isn’t Mathis a Marlin now?
All incorrect
Im going to guess Izturis
Winner
Izturis is the answer
I figured because they spent time in the same division and because Izturis has a short compact swing that he may be the type to be able to hit a knuckleball.
What did I win? lol
Or you looked it up…. Hmmmmm.
Reyes?
Melky?
If Dickey is Game 1 starter, then JPA is not an opening day starter. In your face jpa!
AA may still make another move before the season starts
I know it’s almost impossible to not make a reigning Cy Young winner your opening day starter, but wouldn’t an optimum rotation setup have Dickey between JJ and Morrow to further throw off opposing hitters timing?
I guess it depends on whether or not that popular narrative is bullshit.
It would still work, you’d just need to start one of them right after Dickey and one of them 5th. Only problem is you’d have the lefties together.
True. Also, doesn’t Romero have reverse splits so is having the lefties together really a big deal?
I don’t think there’s any evidence that this phenomenon actually exists.
Fangraphs has to have something on it…shit they’ve got everything else.
My bet is on Morrow leading it off with Buerle 2 and Romero 3. That allows the start of Dickey, Johnson and Morrow for the Massholes. Suck IT farrell.
Fuck…the Jays only have one off day in April. I am pretty sure it was like 3-4 this year.
I do wonder what the plan is for opening day.
The Jays should put three strongest pitchers against the red sox.
After Farrell’s backstabbing of the Jays he deserves to face Dickey,Morrow & Johnson.
agreed, ‘real oakville69′.
Dickey
Romero
Morrow
Buehrle
Johnson
Breaks up the lefties.
Keeps Dickey away from soft thrower Buehrle.
Farrel faces all new arms in the first series.
Dickey closes out the Massholes for a sweep.
“fuck you, Farrell!!” da, da, da-da-da!!
You’d need at least one of the lefties if not both pitching in the Indian series to avoid them facing Boston in the next. That Sox lineup rapes left handers.
Looks like Gose’s ”43” will have to go. Oh yeah, and another thing…..John Farrell can blow me.
Why hes insurance on Rasmus and Melky who only have 2 years on control.
Pretty sure he’s referring to how Dickey’s number with the Mets was 43.
fuck HIV…as said before, your name is kinda offensive…but you’re CCR5 receptor antagonists antiretroviral drugs are inhibiting your ability to read.
I’d like to think he’s making fun of something a little bit different then what’ you’re thinking.
But I ultimately agree. I’m quite sure I’d never let a friend make that type of joke in front of my family.
But as long as the side effects dont include death*, he’s ok.
* ok ok, death, and his dick falling off
It’ll be tired again soon, but I hadn’t seen any Farrell bashing in a while… so good timing, +1
Suck it Farrell
Gonna need an update to the Good Will Hunting photoshop
so Robert Allen Dickey’s initials spell RAD – yup, 38 years ago, that would have been a great handle.
Welcome to Title Town CA, RA!!
common dm…you’re dating yourself using the word ‘handle’..re:BuckMartinezHairyPubes.
Sorry but some of us have been using the interweb since alt.sport.*** has been around. Much before the espn/sun troll sections and even all these hipster blogs.
Old school Leaves basher….I digress.
It will be nice for the Yanks to be able to stay in the race for that extra WC playoff spot….till about mid September maybe
There is still so much off season left, I wonder if AA has yet another move on the horizon. Bull pen depth, AAAA starters, and a better DH option than Lind is about all that can be improved.
And I guess Drabek, Hutchison, and McGowan are pretty damn good 7/8/9 type guys if any of them will be healthy for 2013.
Fill out the bench and improve the pen with adding buffalo depth guys would be my guess
Davis, Bonifacio, Thole, and Cooper is a pretty decent bench. Could maybe get a better bat, but this isn’t the national league. Getting a legit DH to push Lind to the bench would be a nice move.
oops and Gose too
Hutch 2014 , Drabek maybe Aug. Can anyone count on McGowan ever?
@jimmuchuchu…all of the above. Only FA signings though…have to save Sanchez/Goose/Smoral for deadline deals.
If this wont convince Oliver to come back for one more year I don’t know what will
he doesn’t have a ring yet! come on black magic, you have 40 more years to sit around at home after 2013
+ fuckin 1
this will go down as the worst trade in blue jays history
Would you mind emailing me next weeks lottery numbers?
what would it take for that to happen? Dickey busts and becomes dead weight for four years and d’Arnaud and Syndergaard bloom into perennial all stars.
What are the chances d’Arnaud becomes an all star? can’t be more than 50%? who knows. Same with Syndergaard, but with even less chance given that he’s only played A ball so far.
There are some huge risks to this trade, it took big balls, but the odds are that it will work out for both teams.
It seems a fair amount of scouting reports project TDA to be more of an above average regular than an all star.
And remember, the majority of prospects don’t ever become what they are “projected” to be.
For all we know, AA considers TDA to be in the Brett Wallace boat of prospects who could be good, but nothing to lose sleep over.
you’re missing the point. there’s no need to do this trade. the jays were not some 90 win team missing 1piece. they were a 89 loss team. the jays had all the leverage. the mets had no other good offers. no need to overpay
again…please forward lottery numbers to sukitfarrell@hotplace.com
It could be called a slight over-pay but that is the cost of business when your a projected 89 WIN team looking to hit 92+. What the fuck are gonna do with your point?! Please reply in a couple of years…we are gonna either compete hard in the ALCS/WS or bust. Or maybe we should wait for 2016 when NS to be an impact player…oh wait..by then JBau. has requested a trade and other ‘IN PLACE’ pieces have started to receed.
What the fuck do you want? No trade and in six months you are whining for AA to pull trigger on a deal or in 10 months you are hi-fivin your ‘friends’ on ” ” street? GTHFO
Jays rotation: From Dickey to Ricky!
+5
Everyone is assuming Romero is going to bounce back (especially after getting surgery). I’m not sure that Ricky>>Happ next season unless last season was only about the injury.
No one is sure, but previous seasons have earned Rickey the benefit of the doubt to start the year. I wouldn’t expect him to have the same kind of rope as last year though, if he starts the season looking like a shitballer, Happ will get a shot at the rotation.
Happ and Romero will have to compete for the 5th spot which is a great thing. But all things even out of spring training Romero surely gets it. It is pretty amazing how far Romero plummeted. A repeat of his rookie season would be good enough production out of the 5th spot.
Rotation jumble:
Ricky Dickey
Brandon Buehrle
R.A. Romero
J.A. Johnson
Mark Morrow
Good trade for right now but in a few years we might feel like we took a Dickey in the Thole.
Any chance Happ gets dealt if this deal goes through?
I hope not. I do NOT want Jenkins as the 6th starter.
those aren’t the only two options. You could trade Happ and still sign other guys to be 6th or 7th starters. Happ as a 6th starter is a waste of an asset, IMO. He showed last year he can be good enough to be a #3 or #4 starter on many teams (with weak rotations), and that’s a lot of value to keep down in Buffalo.
My personal preference would be to unload Buehrle and the $48M owed to him over the next three years, and then slot Happ in as the #5 guy.
I don’t think Happ would go to Buffalo, I imagine he would take CV as long relief and still end up starting 15+ games due to injury. I wouldn’t be opposed to trading Buehrle (and signing a couple AAAA pitchers) if the money gets put into a JJ extension. Definitely worth sacrificing some value in 2013 for making 2014 and 15 stronger.
Of course with the Jays luck, they would do exactly that and then JJ’s arm would explode putting the last flourish of his signature on the extension.
Dr. James Andrews will sit right next to JJ to supervise the signing of the document.
I would say he’s not going anywhere. He fulfills CV’s role out of the pen to a T. Besides if he was good enough to be our 5th starter before Friday why get rid of him now? Got to have that depth to keep the ball rolling. As Kman is saying now and I’ve been saying for a while, it would be great if they turned around and signed another starter like Marcum and then traded Buehrle, but I really don’t see that happening now. I also think it’s less likely that Johnson gets extended unless Rogers steps up to the plate since 2014 salary just took a big leap forward with the Dickey trade.
Of course it’s entirely possible considering everything that’s gone on of late. For all the talk of shared risk that had been mentioned between AA and Johnson’s agent, I would love to AA throw Johnson a quick 2 year extension to cover Dickey’s time. Johnson could then hit the market going into his age 31 season and probably score a deal similar to what Cliff Lee did at a year older.
I think Happ could be traded if Oliver comes back.
The current Jays starters made 148 starts last season. It makes the swingman role that Carlos V has filled the last two years less important.
If Happ could land another young, controllable Chad Jenkins-style #5/6 starter to play in Buffalo that would probably be more optimal for the team as it is currently constructed.
seriously? You think a AAA starter is more valuable than Happ? Did you follow baseball in 2012?
Uh, no.
I’m suggesting that another team’s Chad Jenkins is about all you can expect for Happ in trade.
The guy was bordering on being a non-tender candidate for half the season.
He had a goof year by advanced metrics, but his ERA sucked and then he got injured.
At a projected $3.8 mill via arbitration he doesn’t have a ton of trade value.
Interesting you just mentioning this. Was running the payroll numbers for 2014 and for 22 players (RAD@$14 million) I’ve got payroll at roughly $132 million once you factor in the arbitration raises for 7 players.
Happ and Rasmus would both be 3rd year eligible and could potentially rake it in with successful seasons in 2013.
Would be shocked if there was a Johnson extension at all now. I wonder if AA turned towards Dickey as a cheaper option for 2014.
I don’t think it’s that simple.
For starters, clearing the $18 million Buehrle is owed in 2014 could go towards Johnson.
Rasmus could be gone in favour of the cheaper Gose.
Not to mention that the payroll could go up to $150 million and maybe beyond.
Beeston mentioned $150 million before the big increase in national TV money.
If the team does well and attendance goes up like you would expect it to with sold out games other than just a couple of big ones, for example, then the sky is the limit for the payroll. Instead, expect ticket prices to start going up again.
Such would be the cost of winning.
@ NM
You’re right to wonder and bring up a very valid point about how high Rogers will take payroll.
Except , you shouldn’t base your expectations upon past revenue generated.
How many people have you heard talkin baseball lately?
How many callers to the Fan say their gonna buy tickets next year?Hell even oakville69 might buy an addtional flexpack.
The author of this post goes to a family gathering and they break out into a discussion about Dickey.
What do ya think the TV ratings will be in 2013?
Attendance?
And what is that worth to Rogers across all platforms?
You know what it’s worth to teams like Texas,LAD,NYY and so on.
Sportsnet is the Canadian YES network.
Happ and Cecil have no minor league options remaining. I am not sure about Romero.
Much of the rosterbation will be based on who has minor league options remaining.
Jenkins and McGuire are destined to pitch in the minors as depth as will McGowan, on what will be his umpteeth stay on the 60 day DL.
Its possible that Happ could slip through waivers given his price tag and could be assigned to AAA but let’s not bet on that yet. I doubt many will be clamoring to claim Cecil if he is assigned to AAA.
There will be many GM’s hovering around the waiver wire to monitor the now pitching rich Blue Jays to see who gets kicked to the curb. So on that level, any ideas of making a trade for J.A. fucking Happ is plain idiotic as a GM can claim him if he is assigned.
for everyone who think darnaud is nothing, compare this, JPA is already worth 1.4 WAR, you know the guy witha .275 obp? so how much more do you think darnaud would be 3 WAR? I’d rather have that for 6 years.
I’ve noticed you posting since the Miami trade. And.you’ve been wrong about everything.
I’m convinced Ur doing.it on purpose. It’s the only explanation
I think this is Ginger Campbell who has been AWOL since the Miami trade.
Oakville, ginger, impersonator of its all over – they’re all the same.
Right now the team is trying to win the World Series in 2013. WAR from D’Arnaud in 2018 doesn’t help with that. This trade makes them unquivocally better in 2013, to the extent folks are saying they’re the division favourites in the A.L. East.
Of course, they’re giving up a lot, but at some point you’re losing the forest for the trees. They Jays are legit world series contenders if this deal goes through. That’s the bottom line.
Dickey/JPA WAR over the next three seasons could more than offset the potential of D’Arnaud in, say, 14-18. Meaning the WAR value could very well be a wash.
trolling is fun…it says alot about…
Any guesses for the 25th man on the roster?
The internal candidate at the moment would probably be Moises Sierra.
A few other guys who could be signed for $1 million or so or maybe on a minor league deal:
Jeff Baker
Casey McGeehee
Matt Diaz
Andrew Jones was one option before he got his massive deal in Japan.
Mike McCoy?
Someone cheap, wouldn’t surprise me if it was an infielder who could at least play short.
CC Sabathia sighting:
https://www.google.ca/search?q=sabathia+fat&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&tbo=d&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=1rDOUKOiIaTY2gX8_YH4CA&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1024&bih=672#biv=i|2;d|RKzfofSNj0LhwM:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqRZqvlDvT4
Hank ‘n Dickey. A winning combination.
i love how there’s one pic of papelbon doing his shit in the woods celebration in the middle
I don’t know that it’s actually true, but if knuckle-ballers actually mess with hitters timing for more than one game (ie. Wakefield messing with the Jays), wouldn’t it be smart to try and have Dickey lead off as many series as possible? Hypothetically, it would be pretty simple to see which rotation spot leads off the most series and put him there.
It’s actually true,
The best use of the knuckle baller is to have him the second pitcher in series.
The best example of how the timing is messed up, is to have an excellent fastball hitter go and try to hit a high arcing slow pitch.It’s actually funny to watch how a guy who can pound a 90 MPH fastball, whiff helplessly at a slow pitch.Then, once he gets his timing down on the slow pitch, start throwing 90MPH fastballs and watch him whiff again.
Except it usually pisses him off.
Oh yeah, before I lay me down to sleep…….Suck it Farrell!
Less than 36 hours and 15 minutes left for this to be announced.
Tic tic tic
Like waiting for a pot of water to boil.
You need a hotter oven.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_cooking
I’m still concerned about the Jays’ ability to sustain success going forward. I felt that the Miami trade did not hurt our sustainability; this trade does, unfortunately.
We’ll need to make a trade to replenish the farm at some point. A year or two. That’s why we need to extend Johnson.
Should be a fun 2013 though.
also if Rogers continues to spend that will help too. This team isn’t that old, and we still have guys like Lawrie, maybe Rasmus, Morrow, Romero, etc. that have many years left in the bank.
I’m not worried.
All the core pieces are signed for atleast 2 years except Johnson. Extending him would be great, but the Rotation is still pretty wicked without him. Plus it would add a draft pick if he goes. Maybe Drabek is ready. Maybe Nolin. Maybe Hutch. Maybe random FA.
2 years out Melky and Colby are done, but Gose should be ready for one of those spots. Signing another OF or extending Colby shouldn’t be hard.
3 years out is a crapshoot. So many prospects will have either graduated or busted by then it’s impossible to know how things look. Plus 3 more years of draft picks to restock the shelves.
I find it funny reading about those addicted to prospect porn lamenting the fact that AA is giving up d’Arnaud and Syndergaard for Dickey. One needs to be reminded, in the great words of Kenny Ken Ken, that the Jays can amend the deal if the Dickey isn’t extended.
Assuming everything goes down, its a win-win trade for both teams. The Mets get two solid prospects and the Jays get a CY Young winner for practically nothing, if you look at the current market prices for ace level pitchers.
Prospect pron addicts can now fixate themselves on guys like Aaron Sanchez, who might be the best arm in the Jays system, despite his command issues. Some scouts have pondered the possibility that Syndergaard’s future could hinge on his off-speed offerings. That is, if Syndergaard doesn’t develop his secondary pitches, his future could be limited to being a bullpen guy with a plus FB and decent curve ball.
As for d’Arnaud, yeah, that one hurts as he was our prized return in the Halladay trade. He was the last hope in what was a big loss for the Blue Jays, to see the great Roy Halladay depart for greener pastures in Philly. Gose remains an enigma, a player who has loud tools except that he can’t hit, at least not yet. As for Drabek, well, if he recovers from his 2nd TJS, and if he can find the strike zone, he might pan out, but chances are getting slimmer with each passing season. d’Arnaud was the saviour piece in the Halladay trade, and now he is gone. Let’s all cry in our fucking beers shall we?
Once we go through the mourning process, lets remember that we are getting an exceptional pitcher in Dickey. He gives us a chance, should we be called upon to play off in a one game play-in for a wild-card. He should anchor the rotation with his 200 + innings and 200 + strikeouts. Slide him between Morrow and Johnson and opposing lineups will be fucking dizzy trying to hit that shit.
AA is pushing all of his chips and is saying to the AL East, I am the boss of this fucking table. Look at the Rangers, they lost Hamilton, Greinke, and likely lost out on Dickey also. Fuck Yu Darvish. Its our turn now bitches. Lets fucking enjoy this moment and hope that we get some good health in 2013.
One last item. The Jays’ minor league system has taken a big fucking hit on the BP and BA ratings. So who the fuck cares. You don’t see banners hanging outside the ballpark with the caption that reads, best minor league system in baseball. Besides, there are still some good pieces that remain with the Jays. For the prospect porn addicts, here is something that you can read to soothe you to sleep:
Prospect Push
Personal Favorites: Roberto Osuna
by Jason A. Churchill
As the Top 10 Prospects for each organization are rolled out this offseason, I often find myself focusing on a particular few prospects from each club. For the Indians, it’s Francisco Lindor, about whom I wrote a few weeks back. For the Toronto Blue Jays, it’s right-hander Roberto Osuna, who reminds me, in one way at least, of Texas Rangers shortstop Jurickson Profar.
Osuna became a favorite of mine after seeing him debut in the Northwest League this past summer. He won’t turn 18 until February and already displays a mature feel for pitching while flashing plus stuff. While he’s nothing like Profar physically and pitches rather than playing an athletic position and taking four turns in the batter’s box every night out, the two have one thing in common: polish beyond their years.
I saw Profar in the same league at the same exact age in 2010, at a time when most outside the industry hadn’t a clue who he was and one thing was clear: he wasn’t going to remain under the radar much longer.
Osuna possesses some of those same types of attributes but also offers fluid mechanics, above-average velocity into the mid-90s, and a body that is ready to take on a heavier-than-typical workload, which could get him to the big leagues quicker than otherwise would be expected.
At 6-foot-2 and 235 pounds, the 17 year old will need to be disciplined with his conditioning or it could become a problem, but the arsenal is exciting. That arsenal includes a two-plane curveball that he can throw for called strikes and will use as a swing-and-miss pitch, as he did versus much more experienced competition in 2012. His change-up is firm, but he keeps it down in the zone, and it shows some splitter-like action late in its path toward the plate, garnering its share of missed bats.
Osuna, despite the size, needs to get stronger and build some endurance. As he moved into the 75-80 pitch range, he put more effort into his delivery (perhaps necessary to maintain his velocity), though he stuck with his game plan.
Despite the effects the extra effort appeared to bring and his generally below-average command, the Mexico native remained poised and dominated thanks to his three-pitch mix and the ability to think his way through each inning.
From the stretch, Osuna worked at 91-92 mph mostly, but the curveball was still sharp and his changeup was a real weapon. He cut himself off a few times in the start I witnessed, but numerous scouts opined late in the summer that the right-hander is among the most impressive teenage arms they’d seen.
“That is a very polished starting pitcher, considering he’s just 17 and in the States for the first time [this year],” one club’s Pro Scouting Director said. “You have to love a kid that can use all of his pitches and shows a lot of confidence in what he’s doing and how he goes about his business.”
The Blue Jays, even after having traded away left-hander Justin Nicolino and righty Henderson Alvarez, remain stocked with young pitching, and Osuna is a big part of that, bringing no. 2 upside to full-season ball in 2013.
If he’s disciplined with his conditioning regiment, Osuna could speed through the minors and hit the big leagues by 2015 or 2016, when he’ll be 20 or 21 years of age, with the disabled list the only potential road block (as is the case with all young arms). That ETA happens to be a similar timetable Profar appears to be on for the Rangers, oddly enough.
Watch for Osuna to make a move this coming season, not only up through the minors but further up the Jays’ top prospect list next offseason, when he’ll have a full year of pro ball under his belt and a chance to make some adjustments and answer some questions.
Another thing, you really think AA and Gibbons would put a rookie catcher in the bigs handling the 2013 staff when we are pushing to win the division and the world series? Love him or hate him, JPA has 2 + years in the show.
Yeah, I am lamenting the loss of d’Arnaud like everyone, but lets remember that the likelihood of seeing d’Arnaud behind the plate for most of 2013 was a pipe dream. A catcher has to earn his spurrs. JPA has flaws as do most catchers, but he at least knows how to handle a MLB pitching staff. All he needs to do is hit dingers, smile at the ladies, block a few pitches, and call a good game.
Awesome report on Osuna. It’s a reminder of the inroads the Jays seem to have made in Latin America, or at least the emphasis AA has placed on the international FA market. Hopefully that can continue to be another source of top flight prospects to replenish the capital spent this offseason.
more evidence of why this is a horrible deal
WAR the last 2 years
dickey 8.7
weiters 8.0
shocking no? and that’s with weiters hitting pretty avg and dickey a cy young.
this is why you don’t trade catchers. they are way too valuable. darnuad doesn’t have to be posey. he just has to be avg.
funny how I don’t hear anybody calling alex a ninja on this one.
I don’t think there’s any question that, viewed in a contextual vacuum, this trade is a pretty big overpayment. But the more I’ve read and thought about it, I’ve decided I’m okay with it.
The bottom line is – you’re either in for 2013, or you’re out. In between is no place to be, and it’s a place the Jays have been stuck for far too long. The Miami trade essentially said “we are competing right now”, and with that decision made, you’ve got to go all in. Take the best possible shot you can, or don’t bother.
That said, I still wonder about the argument that this kind of overpayment for more pitching is the kind of thing you wait to do until something like the trade deadline, once you have a better idea if your team is in the hunt – not when you’re looking good on paper, but haven’t played a single game.
+1 exactly, no need to do this deal now. dickey wasn’t going anywhere. get him at the deadline for a lot less.
Kidding me?
Dickey burned his bridges with the Mets and the threat of a drop off is a pretty real one. He’s at peak value now.
The price is gonna be steep by he was going somewhere this off season,
Suppose the club isn’t able to procure Dickey’s services at the deadline, heaven forbid the Yankees could get him. The Blue Jays will have to battle to make it to the playoffs, and anything similar to Dickey’s 27 quality starts from the previous season will enhance their chances at the post season.
Gentlemen, how’s this for a lineup?
Reyes
Rasmus
Bautista
Encarnacion
Cabrera
Lawrie
Lind
Izturis/Bonifacio
Arencibia/Thole
Cabrera will bat 2nd. Doubt Gibbers will be as LRLR obssessed as Farrel was
Also think I would bat Boni/Izturis last/ When the line up turns over it would be like back to back leadoff hitters
Well, you do have to wonder what else would be available for darno and synder.
Who has pitched better over the last 3 years than Dickey (with no greater risk of a fall-off in performance?
Verlander, Price, Hernandez, Cain, a few others
No one that you would able to pry away without giving up a whole lot more, and that’s not even to mention that Dickey would be on a 3 or 4 year deal, exactly the length you want to tie up a pitcher, at a likely reasonable rate.
It’s painful to give up elite prospects, but if that’s what it takes then it’s otiose to say either you could get someone better or you should simply pay less.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/12/kbo-teams-to-sign-eveland-richmond-.html
Remember when these guys were semi-regular starters for the Jays?
Which, of course, is below the level of NPB, which, of course, makes it all the more awesome.
Well I’m in the process of getting an ESL teaching job in Korea, so that’s good news. A few familiar faces to say hi to when I go see some Korean baseball. Dave Bush is also in the league.
Apparently Red Sox have signed Drew on a 1yr deal
Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN
Stephen Drew gets $500K in performance bonuses, to go along with $9.5 million salary, in his agreement with the Red Sox.
The Red Sox may not be at their peak this year, but they’re still going to be legitimate contenders if Lester and Buckholz rebound.
Great web site. A lot of helpful info here. I’m sending it to some pals ans also sharing in delicious. And certainly, thanks on your effort!
Bribery is a great way to get kids working for you:) and New Jeff had just the right amount of subtle confidence. I think he’s a winner!