St Louis Cardinals v Philadelphia Phillies - Game 5

After the Jays made their big moves this winter, and Rogers finally decided to put their money where for years their mouths had been, a lot of fans took a look at the contract status of Josh Johnson, and at the contract status of Roy Halladay, and made a connection.

Johnson, of course, is a free agent at the end of the season, while the dear departed Harry Leroy has an option for 2014 that only vests if he throws 415 innings combined between 2012 and 13– a virtually impossible task after injuries limited him to just 156 innings last season. The Jays could let Johnson walk and welcome a returning hero eager to jump ship as his Phillies sink into decline, right?

Right???

Yeah, about that…

Halladay spoke to the media at the Phillies complex in Clearwater, as reported by Todd Zolecki of MLB.com, and while nobody could reasonably expect him to be edging his way out the door, I’m pretty sure a lot of hopeful Jays fans will be thinking that he didn’t really need to go this far. (Emphasis on the dagger through the heart mine.)

“I think all our dialogue right now has been, ‘How do we get things going in the right direction?’” said Halladay, when asked if he has talked with the Phillies about a contract extension. “Really, that was my concern. I know it was their concern, and I’m not at all worried about next season. I really am not. I’m worried about this year and making the most of this year and then you go from there. But there has been no dialogue, and I don’t expect there to be dialogue. I expect to prepare to go out and do my job and let everything else take care of itself.

“I really don’t [envision myself pitching anywhere]. If I had my druthers, I would be here until I’m done. As good as they’ve been to me, I think they realize I’d be as good to them as I could be. Going forward, I really don’t see myself playing anywhere else. And I don’t want to play anywhere else. This has been the best place I’ve ever played.”

So… yeah. Halladay has never actually hit the free agent market, and could have made a shit-tonne more money in his career if he did. The straight-up capitalism and the attention of it all just doesn’t seem to suit him, and I just don’t think we should expect it to change in the next twelve months.

Anything can happen, of course. This isn’t necessarily a dead end for the pipe dream. But… yeah. If you were somehow genuinely hopeful, I… uh… I think you might want to rethink that a little bit.

Comments (103)

  1. This just in: Americans prefer living in america

    • well i’d sooner have em live in america rather than poison our country (with the exception of baseball players of course)

    • I don’t thinks that’s what he meant.

      Form a baseball perspective, there is no argument that Philly is the best place he’s ever been. Perfect games, no-hitters, playoff successes, historically good rotation etc etc.

  2. A single tear just rolled into my beard.

    Deep breath. Dickeythebest.

  3. Leroy coming back to the Jays has always been a “huh, that’d bekinda fun if it happens” thing for me but never a “I must see that happen kind of thing”.

    I guess… I guess just want him to be happy! *sniff*

  4. Fuck you Roy Halladay

    • Don’t stand too close to any trees in the storm.

    • The more casual references a man makes to blow jobs, the fewer blow jobs he is likely to receive over the course of his lifetime. Causal relationship or simply a correlation?

  5. Hmmm an extremely loyal guy showing loyalty to his current employer. The same employer that has allowed him to experience the playoffs. You know, the entire reason he left his original employer to whom he was also very loyal.

    Stop the presses!

    • +1.

      I don’t expect Roy Halladay to demand a trade to Toronto. What would happen if he had said he enjoyed playing in Toronto more than Philly?

      The Philly fans would throw batteries at him.

      I would love to see Halladay return but I concede it is unlikely.

    • thats what i got out of it aswell.

      He never said a bad word about the Jays, and I think we all understood he wanted to make the playoffs, and that wasn’t going to happen with the Jays back then.

      But now that he can make the playoffs with the Jays, and everyone expecting the Phils to maybe hit 500, who knows anything can happen.

      Extend JJ, and remove or trade the 5th best starter next year, then bring the Doc back, you think the buzz is big this year, fuck, thats a wet dream.

    • I’d agree, except that he didn’t have to include the bit about how Philadelphia was the best.

  6. Stoeten breaks hearts at Valentines…It was a nice dream…

  7. Doc Halladay: Prescribing a cure for your delusion!

  8. At least he’ll be right in his comfort zone in 3rd place.

    (FUCK I DIDN’T WANNA GO THERE DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU DID TO US DOC?!?)

  9. David price is a pipe dream that should Johnson not be extended should happen

  10. Wait, he said “this has been the best place I have ever played” so that doesn’t necessarily mean that Toronto is the worst…wait…you mean he only ever played for the two teams? OUCH.

  11. So you’re saying there’s a chance!

  12. Let’s not forget that RA Dickey was a “pipedream” a week before he was acquired.

    • Let’s.

    • A week before the Dickey trade, there were multiple sources indicating that Dickey was likely on his way out and that something was in the works between the Mets and Jays. That doesn’t compare to this situation on any level.

  13. I don’t see Roy being the type of guy to call a spade a spade and say that Philly is a sinking ship.

    I think he’s just telling the fans thru the media that he would like to stay, and it’s the best place he’s ever played…BLAH BLAH BLAH ( typical interview )

    If Roy stays in Philly for the rest of his career, good for him but if he decides to jump in the free agent pool and try to win a championship with any team that stands a chance to win then good on him as well.

  14. Wow, this actually made me really sad. Does this mean Roy will go into the HOF as a Phillie? That would be the most depressing sight 2004 Ray could possibly imagine.

    (deep breath)

    DickeyJohnsonMorrowBuehrleRomero! 2013 baby!

  15. I’m pretty sure the team of ex-NASA renegades that put together Halladay scripted his loyalty function to output “this is the best place I’ve ever played” until free agency.

  16. I will forever hold onto the pipe dream that maybe, just maybe, Ole Roy will lace up them blue cleats again and be a veteran starter on a relevant team. Roy will always be the best.

  17. I see Philadelphia looking to unload Halladay before Halladay looks to leave. I mean, first of all, Halladay’s incredibly loyal, we know that.

    But still, look at that team. If their championship window isn’t already closed, it’s going to be closed in the immediate future, and there’s very little that team is going to be able to do to get back into contention. Their core is mostly on the wrong side of 30. This is a team that’s going to get worse with each successive year. At some point, Philadelphia is going to come to the conclusion that getting rid of Roy Halladay, either by letting him go as a free agent and getting the comp pick, or by trading him, is what’s best for the team.

    It might not be this offseason. But soon.

    • RAJs goals likely complicate the matter, though. How much longer does he get to sit in the GM chair? He’s a little like JPR in the last few years of his tenure.

      He inherited a great situation and though he kept the Phillies winning for a few more years, on the whole he’s done a pretty poor job.

      Philly’s window has likely closed. But the possibility of winning is still going to be there for a little while longer.

  18. Does anyone really want 37 year old Halladay back anyways? Fairservice is right: Cliff Lee.

    • Lee for gose + osuna

      • Personally i would keep osuna he was as good as the big three and 16. Heck he is polished and still young to work on his secondary before his first cup of coffee.

    • There’s a decent chance Roy Halladay is better than Josh Johnson in 2013 and even 2014.

      He’s #5 on MLBTRs 2014 free agent list for a reason. He had a poor year after 4 amazing years.

      Sure, Cliff Lee should be better than both Johnson and Halladay. But he also has a lot of remaining years left on his contract, a NTC and would require giving up quality assets.

      Roy Halladay doesn’t need to be the best pitcher in baseball to be a desirable commodity.

      • Yep. Even if the new standard for Halladay is 2012 (which remains to be seen), he’s still a damn good pitcher in this league and probably will be so for a while yet.

    • Doc is going to be around into his 40s, hes a worker, work horse, perfectionist

      i can remember him acting like he lost the game giving up a solo hr when the jays were up by 5.

      You want a true ball player – no one better then Doc.

      He would turn our young pitchers into studs just by leading by example.

  19. I remember the day I decided i was more of a jays fan than a halladay fan…. it was about a half a second after bautista crushed a no doubter off of him his first time back in toronto.

    • Same. Doc is my favourite Jays pitcher ever, so it was weird going into that game with him in Toronto pitching against “us”. I almost wondered if I’d be more pumped if Halladay pitched well, or the Jays hit him. Turns out, once the game started, he just became another opposing pitcher. The Bautista hr was a thing of beauty.

    • Hear, hear.

  20. Is this a big tongue in cheek joke?

    “This has been the best place I’ve ever played.” That is somehow a dagger through the heart of Toronto? I know Doc himself was great in Toronto, but honestly what the hell was so special about Toronto for him?

    We had shit attendance in a very unsexy stadium. We had just above mediocre teams and sinking ships and JPR and his mediocre moves. He played in a grand total of zero meaningful games with us and when he left, he was ironically our biggest hope for one day being better – years down the road.

    I know you (Andrew) aren’t being that serious, but even as a joke I think it is a bit poor taste, considering how loyal Doc actually was and how he stuck around at all to give us anything worth watching.

  21. (a) What was he supposed to say?; and

    (b) Why would the Blue Jays want him back now, at the point of diminishing returns?

    • a) Maybe stopping short of saying “this has been the best place I’ve ever played” when you only have ever played one other place– especially if you’re supposedly going to consider going back.

      b) Because his contract is up and a new one would reflect that.

      • Can’t blame him for saying that. Anyone ever watch a game in the City of Brotherly Love? It’s a baseball town, phanatics. Sold out. Yeah, they have the mascot too.

        We touched 25 g’s on average during his tenure, with an organization during that time dog fuckin it to create a winner.

        Roys always a winner in Toronto………… I will always have nothing but respect for him.

        • Fuck him Roy can kiss my ass

        • I’m with you bastard. I have no issue with Doc. I literally got a “fuck off” from our fearless leader here for politely stating as much.

          If you rag on Doc for saying this, then never ever complain about athletes giving boring useless cliche answers to questions.

      • @Andrew

        Couldn’t it be Roy simply saying what the Philly reporter and their fans want to hear?

        You know, like how AA tells fans what they want to hear about chemistry and such :)

        • @Jays 2010.

          Good point. I wouldn’t expect Haladay or any other player to bash their current team. That PR 101.

          Stoeten has warned Jays fans that they should not get excited about the possible return of Halladay for the last year.

      • I’m pretty sure I read a quote of Doc saying the same thing about Philly last year (and possibly a few times over his time there). Really, what else would you expect him to say to the Philadelphia media and fans? That Toronto was better to play for/more enjoyable? Even if that was true (which I doubt), he wouldn’t say it in that situation.

        He’ll want to stay in Philly as long as they remain a contender. If they stop being so, that competitive urge for a championship will drive him somewhere else.

      • @Stoeten. I wouldn’t expect Doc to mesure his words & say Toronto is better than Philly. It’s a classic talking for players to say they are happy in whatever city they are currently playing.

        Doc didn’t bash Toronto . JP Riccardi blinsided Halladay with the trade rumors at the All Star Break.

        • Let’s not rewrite history too badly here, thanks.

          • @Stoeten.

            I don’t recall Halladay complaining about Toronto in 2009. All he said was that he wasn’t planning on signing another extension with the Jays. It was Riccardi who started the trade talks at the All Star Break. The team didn’t want to compete with Halladay, who had already signed a below market extension a few years earlier.

    • Gotta agree with Derrick here on both points. So he likes philadelphia, so fucking what? It’s not like he said “it my favourite place I’ve played, especially compared to that shithole Toronto.”
      Also, at this point is there room for halladay? I didn’t watch him last year but from what I’ve read he’s not the same guy he was and not a great candidate to bounce back. Honest question, who has a better 2013, halladay or josh Johnson?

      • I’d still take Doc for this year. And the people who think the Jays couldn’t use him don’t have a clue what they’re talking about.

        Halladay 2012 season: 7.60 K/9, 2.07 BB/9, 1.04 HR/9, 3.69 FIP, 3.60 xFIP
        Johnson 2012 season: 7.76 K/9, 3.06 BB/9, 0.66 HR/9, 3.40 FIP, 3.73 xFIP

        Halladay’s injury filled “bad” season is quite comparable to Josh Johnson’s healthy “good” season.

        • @Fullmer.

          Thanks for the stats. I would take Halladay as well, but Johnson is an acceptable replacemen.

          Jays fans have been so spoiled the last few months. Last summer when AA tried to get Johnson, fans would have been over the moon. Now he is an afterthought compared to Dickey, Reyes 7 Melky.

        • Fullmer’s got it right.

          IIRC, going by the 50/30/20 method Halladay projects out to 5 fWAR for 2013.

          Of course, he did suffer an injury and lose some velocity last year. But it’s not as though he can’t be effective with reduced velocity.

          And nobody is expecting him to come back as a “hero”. He doesn’t need to be the best player on a team anymore.

        • Wait, Johnson’s 2012 is supposed to be representative of a “good” season for him???

          • He’s the one who’s been saying he was healthy all season. The 2012 season could be JJ’s new baseline just as well as 2012 could be Halladay’s new baseline.

  22. When do Melky, Reyes, Oliver report

  23. My heart, it hurts ever so much.

    But in all seriousness if he makes it to FA I do hope the jays try and lure him back with a dumptruck full of money, or barring that throw it at Price.

  24. I wonder what would happen if AA called up and offered them Kyle Drabek back, and a couple other plugs.

    Just the very idea of suggesting the return of Drabek to get Doc back would be utterly hilarious

  25. What else would he say? He made the playoffs, two no hitters, plays next to Cliff Lee and Cole Hamels and makes a shit ton of money. People shouldn’t get too upset about his comments

    • +1000.
      Let’s get some perspective here. He went to the playoffs in Phillie and the ownership there put a way better team on the field than ownership here did while he played in TO. He wants to stay and good luck to him. Meanwhile we have other fish to fry. (You see what I did there?)

  26. the biggest question is: what hat will Roy be wearing in Cooperstown ?
    and that is the only thing that matters to the Jays, we do not need Doc back

    • Get cliff lee!

      • Wait a sec

        How do we know he is going to make the HOF?

        He has been a great pitcher, but i think Great isn’t enough, based on what we saw this year with the Hall.

        Elect PETE ROSE ALL FUCKING READY!

  27. The only drawback of Doc wearing a Jays cap in Cooperstown is that it would likely be the angry bird one.

    • I think Doc would probably want to wear a Phillies Hat in Cooperstown if he wins a World Series with them.

      MLB forced Dawson to wear an Expos hat.

      Would MLB force Doc to wear a Jays hat? He’s had 3 good years with the Philies so far.

  28. Suck it Doc (oh yeah, and Farrell)

  29. Who uses words like “druthers”, anyways?

  30. Really?! Why would anyone think we could compare to baseball in Philly? Sorry Andrew and any others when I say this but if you were offended by this you need a reality check. Hopefully that quote did it for you

    • @Zaun.

      Playing baseball in Philly must be more exciting than what Halladay endured so many years in Toronto.

      Hopefully, the Rogers Centre atmosphere will improve this year.

    • Please be clear, I don’t count myself among the Jays fans who would give a shit about this.

    • There are a ton of other factors for playing for a team/city other than attendance. Would Colby Rasmus say that he enjoyed playing in St. Louis more than Toronto because St. Louis is more of a “Baseball city”?

    • It’s always sunny in Philadelphia.

      But seriously, why is this a story?

  31. You don’t think 15 million a year is a ton of money. What the fuck is wrong with you and your ilk?

  32. Roy is the classiest guy to have ever put on a Jays uniform, wouldn’t expect him to say anything else for a team that he represents and gets paid from.

    He is who he is, a champ (well sort of)

  33. Maybe he’ll change his mind when we get rid of the turf and go with real grass?

  34. Shame that the only way Roy is getting a ring is if he comes back to Toronto

  35. Usual speak from free agents and usual class from Halladay, especially in Philly where the fans turn on players and throw things at Santa if they sniff something wrong.

    I think he’ll hold true to his word, but I think back with the Jays, assuming that the team is just missing that last piece, would be a close second…either near the tail end of this year or next year.

    Trade deadline pickup as the Phils (somehow) languish near the NL East bottom, and Roy gets to come back and play in front of 40k (instead of the 8500 he was used to) in Skydome in August and September playoff run? Yes please.

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