masthead

UPDATE: See the bottom of the post for what the original line may have said…

Original post:

I don’t want to engage in irresponsible speculation based on a few comments about something that doesn’t appear in a Toronto Sun article that can be found on another blog, but… uh… here goes! (What, would you rather I write about Ryan Langerhans?)

Over the weekend, as I explained in Tuesday’s Daily Duce, Bob Elliott wrote about “the departure from the organization of Tom Burns, a respected long-time scout who recently left the Jays for the Padres, reportedly upset at how scouts have been treated since Brian Parker took over as scouting director last year, and also with the fact that he’d been moved from the amateur side to the pro side. He’s the twelfth scout to leave under Parker’s watch– two others left on their own, while nine were fired.”

It certainly seems curious that there has been so much turnover in that department– though maybe to be expected under a new scouting director– and might have been an interesting subject for a full post over here, if information on the internal comings and goings down at 1 Blue Jays Way weren’t so scarce.

In other words, there wouldn’t have been a lot for me to say.

At least, not based on the version of the article that I saw– which you can see from the image above, has been updated since originally having been posted. That’s not terribly unusual, though. I wouldn’t be shocked if somebody told me that the majority of articles you see posted online in places like the Toronto Sun have updates to them at some point, and that the majority of those are probably for tiny things, like a bit of copy editing, or a small update in information.

Some folks in the comments over at Bluebird Banter, however, claim that they saw something quite noticeably different in the article in question. Here’s a transcript of the relevant comments– you can find the full thread at the bottom of the BBB post, or in a screengrab here.

e&n4e: Maybe I’m going crazy but when I first read the article, I swear there was some clear implication of internal turf war between Parker and LaCava.

MjwW: Oh there definitely was. Not Parker and LaCava, but LaCava and Dana Brown. I’m guessing a more than a few people at One Blue Jays Way didn’t like seeing that, and it sounds like there was some major pushback.

junior_felix_jr: The implication that LaCava wanted to shakeup scouting by letting these guys go and Brown was opposed? Or vice versa?

MjwW: Nothing that direct. See below.

. . .

ClintB: Clearly I’m missing something here. There was more to this article originally?

e&n4e: Yes. It was edited (you can see in the headline that it was “updated” 4 hours later).

MjwW: There was a paragraph, or paragraphs, about how one of Elliott’s sources had said he heard from someone inside Toronto’s org that there was a turf war/power struggle between Dana Brown and LaCava, who are two of the few who actually have AA’s ear, and that may be the reason for some scouts leaving.

Now, no offence to commenters in general, or to the guys who are quoted above, but we’re not exactly working with a reliable bunch of sources here.

Even if they’re correct that the sort of paragraph they’re referring to did once appear in the piece, they’re certainly taking liberties with their suggestion that some kind of sinister pushback from the Jays P.R. department necessarily must have been behind the removal of what they claim they saw.

Information that the alleged statements were incorrect could have come to light from any number of sources, the Sun could have become uncomfortable that what was printed wouldn’t stand up to scrutiny if the Jays disputed it, or… there are any number of possibilities, really. If, again, the supposed paragraph was even in there.

I’ve checked Google’s cache and the internet wayback machine and a few other ways to see if I can find the document as it was originally posted, but have so far come up empty. Even if I– or some intrepid member of the Monkey Army (hint, hint)– did find it, I’m not sure what it would even mean. The information was excised, so as far as we know it’s simply not true and wasn’t fit to print. At least, not after it was originally printed. Y’know, if it originally even was!

Would we be surprised, though, if there was internal strife among the Jays’ front office staff after a season as difficult and as disappointing and dispiriting as this one? Hells naw! You’d probably be worried if they weren’t all bristling about what a complete and total fucking disasterfuck they presided over this year. Still, what it possibly portends for the future, and whether the shakeup in the scouting department may be just the first signs to some other restructuring among the suits, is interesting, even if it all obviously remains to be seen– and may well not be remotely true in the slightest!

Intrigue-ish! Though it’s all baseless and irresponsible speculation, of course.

UPDATE:

A reader emails and says that there was a cached copy of the original piece downloaded to his RSS reader, and the line in question read as follows:

We’re not sure it’s fair to blame Parker for all the changes. Opposing scouts say they hear out on the road a behind the scenes battle is waging between the Dana Brown and Tony LaCava camps. Brown, is an assistant to Anthopoulos, LaCava, an assistant GM, two of the few the GM listens to.

Again, we’re dealing in uncertainties as to the authenticity of the line and what it says. If that’s it, though, it’s beyond entirely plausible that the comments were removed specifically because they’re not correct. And the fact that it’s not anything coming from the Jays very possibly makes it more dubious. Intriguing, though!

Comments (36)

  1. Intriguing!

    In less scandalous scouting news, the Jays placed seven players inside the Appalachian League top 20, with another two(Dean, Robson) just missing.

    • Appy Top 20 from whom? Baseball America?

      • Yeah. Only ten affiliates in the league, but still!

        • haha… yeah… we’ll take what we can get. 3 of the Top 5 players are Jays. And another – Franklin Barretto – may be the most talented of all Bluefield’s roster and wasn’t even considered.

          • Wasn’t Barretto 5th in GCL listing?

            which would make this pool weaker… or is that speculation.

            • yeah you’re right. he’s 5 on the GCL list. sorry about that.

              still, the Jays had 3 of the top 5 players in the Appy league: Davis, Nay and Lugo.

  2. There’s a snake in my boot!

  3. Doesn’t matter. Chemistry means nothing when it comes to having a good team. Right?

    • Being able to use sarcasm doesn’t make you not a hopeless fuckwit.

      • That seems a bit nasty, AS, are you joking or is there some history here we don’t know about

      • You’re fat.

      • Why do you insult people and then ban people that insult you?

        Was there a reason for such an insult? Probably not..

        There’s a reason why professionals think you are a joke and you don’t have a real job.

  4. I wish you or someone knew what responsibilities the scouts who have left/been let go had. If scouting was responsible for all of the off season acquisitions that have been misses, terminations might satisfy the blood lust in many corners of the fan base.

  5. Stoeten you’re missing the bigger issue…

    Alex Anthopolous will no longer be getting any “Tom Burns Specials” and by “Tom Burns Specials” I mean a BJ from Tom Burns.

  6. hmm and if they did not have no robots on there webpages blocked we could have tried this http://archive.org/web/web.php

    and as much as I hate the boggs head, really Kroeg head?

  7. A turnover of 12 under one director is either a mutiny or a cull.

  8. I am confused about which scouts were let go. Is it the scouts that recommended the Marlins trade/ Dickey trade?.

    Minor League scouts?

    Presumably scouts are assigned to each opposing team or division.

    • Scouts let go were supposedly ones that the new SD didn’t like.
      There is a whole system of how they report.Then’s there’s crosscheckers,video checkers and so on.
      The scouts that watch the game, stick to either the pro side or the amatuer side.
      I have a break down somewhere, I’ll take a look.

  9. so Perkins is not reliable? always thought he was good on his info…. t

  10. Arencibia has three games left to bring himself out of the swirling nasty vortex of Mendoza.

    If he hit under the line, for me, I can’t think of any other Jays player in the last 20 years to have that many at bats and hit below two hunny? You guys?

    • He won’t get the start today, with Dickey on the mound, so let’s say he gets 7 more ABs. He would need 4 hits to finish at an even .200. It took him 41 ABs to get his last 4 hits though, so I’m not holding out on a 4/7 performance.

      If he gets 7 PAs, he need to reach base at least twice to avoid posting the lowest OBP by a full-timer since 1968. Hal Lanier rung up a .222 OBP for the Giants that year in 518 PAs, but he was an excellent defensive SS and the league OBP was .297. JP is in a league with a .321 OBP, so his is actually worse when you account for era, and might be the worst OBP relative to league of all time.

      I honestly hope he doesn’t avoid this black mark, because I would love for AA to have to tell him “you posted the lowest OBP by anyone in the last 45 years JP, you’re not getting a raise” in the arbitration hearing. Maybe then finally he would pull his head out of his ass and realize he needs to work his ass off and show some more humility if he wants to stay on the ML roster.

      • Jesus. Lowest on the bags since 68!

        Those are cede numbers. Cede like Stoetens beard on a Saturday morning.

  11. Not knowing the inner workings of an MLB team, I’ll revert to Hollywood, and pretend and be comforted in the fact that some of the schlub scoutsthat were let go from the Jays or have quit, are similar twits to the guys sitting in A’s board room (crap flowing in the room, and, around the floor, literally) in Moneyball.

  12. Just hope that LaCava stays. I thought he was going to get the Washington job, and if he becomes available, any club looking for a new GM would have to be nuts not to consider him.

  13. [...] major upheaval going on at One Blue Jays Way, as discussed by our friends at Bluebird Banter and Drunk Jays Fans. Both pieces are in response to an article written by Bob Elliot at the Toronto Sun who details the [...]

  14. Something sure has to change with blue jay scouting. It seems most other teams have one or more home grown stars while the Jays have none.

    • Think of how long it takes for a player to go from being scouted to being a “home grown star,” then tell me who was running the Jays at that point and whether anything has changed much in between.

      • I guess JPA to an extent could have been close to a homegrown star, maybe Lawrie even if he was acquired by trade. I would love to see Gose, Goins and others pan out on the right side of the spectrum.

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