santanaheavens

All sorts of varying reports this… er… what time is it? Morning?

Anyway, all sorts of reports today about Ervin Santana signing with the Jays. Or maybe the Orioles. Or maybe someone else if a better deal comes along by 5 PM. Or… well… why don’t you lay down and I’ll fill you in…

It started this morning, at least according to my timeline, with tweets from Jon Morosi and Buster Olney, with Morosi tweeting that he’s in Dunedin today and that the Jays people he spoke to were optimistic about their chances to sign Santana, while Olney added that the Jays have played their hand extremely well if they land him, “and they’re working on it.”

MLBTR then went whole hog, passing along a tweet from Dionisio Soldevila of ESPN Deportes, who said that the team and Santana had agreed on a one-year deal would pay him $14-million. Not so fast, though, tweeted Joel Sherman of the New York Post, saying that the deal was being worked on, but wasn’t done. Enrique Rojas of ESPN Deportes then added that Santana indeed has a $14-million offer from the Jays and will sign it… if he doesn’t get a better one by 5 PM. But then, in a piece at ESPNDeportes.com also added that a deal from the Orioles is on the table: a $13-million one with performance incentives — something the Jays won’t do.

About this I will be blunt (if a bit wordy): Santana is no great shakes, though I tend to believe that the awful bump in his road that was 2012 likely happened because he was hurt, that the home run issues at Rogers Centre are overstated, and that the injury concerns aren’t such a big deal on a one-year contract. And if the Jays don’t sign him, and it’s because of some horseshit self-imposed rule from Anthopoulos that only adds to the long list of natural handcuffs this team has, you can pretty much fire him and Beeston and anyone else in this dumb organization who supports that, as far as I’m concerned. Especially if Santana goes to Baltimore along with Ubaldo Jimenez.

Sadly we can’t call for firing ownershp (what are we, Islanders fans?).

Of course, that may well be all of last night’s sweet delicious booze still talking (and I really did have a great time at the Press Club on Dundas, hearing about Paul Bako!), but seriously, if he wants incentives that might pay him more, give him the damn incentives or up your offer until he thinks it’s better. Whatever fear you have of a repeat of the Frank Thomas debacle or some kind of poisonous clubhouse atmosphere where a guy only goes around looking out for number one, um… is it really worth not adding the strong potential of two or three damn wins to your final win total over? Be fucking serious, man. Don’t give us another Yu Darvish gut-punch here, for fuck sakes.

We’ll keep updating this post as the story develops…

2:50 PM Update

Lots of pessimism out there, and for good reason, I guess, given that it currently looks like the Jays might actually be shockingly-dumbly willing to fall on their own sword on this one. That may change still, of course, but for now here’s one more thing to add to the ol’ shit gumbo, via Max Wildstein of Outside Pitch:

In his next tweet he goes further:

OK. That’s cool, Jays. Not sure why anyone should give a shit about this team, since you obviously don’t, but… whatever, it’s just baseball, right? Pffft. Let’s just smell some fake grass and melt on some plastic seats and pay $12 for a fucking beer and not care about the results. There’s a winning fucking marketing pitch for ya! I have all kinds of other gems too, in that vein. Call me! Oh… right! You already did ask me (and a bunch of other bloggers/Twitterati, or something?) to help with your social media nights, which… is bizarre, to say the least. Fittingly Cracker Jack, though, I guess.

Of course, we probably shouldn’t get too worked up about Wildstein, despite the following he has on Twitter. He did tweet earlier that a “source” (the internet?) was telling him that Santana had signed with the Jays, and also “corrected” folks thinking Santana’s self-imposed deadline is 5 PM by telling them it’s 4 PM, even though obviously that’s just because MLBTR said so, and they operate on Central Time, and the original source said 5 PM ET. So… let’s maybe stop retweeting him, eh Griff?

4:35 PM Update

Does this mean anything? Not really — no more than the fact that on Twitter we’ve been following tweets Ervin Santana is favouriting (like this one asking Jays fans to RT if they want him to sign here, or this one congratulating him on trolling both Jays and Orioles fans by following a whole bunch of both), or the fact that I’m somehow trending in Canada (ahead of #pooped!) at the time of this writing [blows on fingers, scratches lapel]– but this is somewhat interesting nonetheless: according to a tweet from Jon Morosi, Jose Bautista has followed Ervin Santana’s suit and is no longer represented by Bean Stringfellow. Both pitchers followed agent Jay Alou, who resigned from his position as Head of Latin Baseball at Stringfellow’s Proformance agency this week.

Forgive me for being the tiniest bit optimistic for a second, but you’d have to think Jose has had some kind of contact with Ervin through all of this. And we’d heard stories earlier in the off-season about Bautista and Edwin Encarnacion lobbying the Jays to sign their friend. So… I don’t know… is it that outlandish to think that maybe this is where he wanted to be all along, and the whole Orioles involvement and self-imposed deadline thing is just a way to extract as much as he can from the Jays before grudgingly signing on their terms? I’d sure like to fucking think so, but it’s still pretty hard to at the moment.

5:05 PM Update

Oh fuck right off. According to a tweet from Jon Morosi… well… this:

So… there’s that.

5:12 PM Update

There’s also this: Roch Kubatko of the Orioles’ broadcaster, MASN, tweets that both the Jays and Orioles have similar offers, around $14.1-million on the table. And then he lays this on us:

Well that was a waste of an afternoon, huh?

5:23 PM Update

So this is a little bit interesting. Remember two updates ago when I mentioned the stuff about the relationship between Bautista and Santana? Seems like it might be a thing. Here’s Jose in Jon Morosi’s serendipitously-timed big picture piece on the Jays at Fox Sports:

“It’s not the same players: We’re missing Josh Johnson, who was supposed to be a big key to our rotation,” Toronto right fielder Jose Bautista said of the 2013-2014 comparison. “One-fifth of your rotation shouldn’t be overlooked. That’s important. That’s why it’s so important that we add (Santana).”

Morosi adds that Bautista has been following the Santana negotiations closely, and throws us this bone, too: “if the Jays spend $14 million on a one-year deal for him, as they would like to do, they will buy a chance to dream again.”

As for the Bautista stuff, I’m not sure how comfortable we should be about a player openly campaigning to the media for the team to sign his friend — especially a player who might have genuine sway — but… I mean… he’s not wrong. Ryan Oakley, as he often does, hits the nail on the head:

Yep.

6:55 PM Update

Enrique Rojas confirms that the Jays and the Orioles are indeed involved here, and that offers are on the table, though he also tells us that a couple other teams are now sniffing around as well. I’d embed the tweet, but it pretty much just says that, only in Spanish.

So… yeah. Doesn’t really change anything, but there’s some news-ish for ya.

Comments (514)

  1. Here we go!

  2. When is this type of signing fury going to happen for Drew? Will it likely happen before the regular season starts?

  3. Guess I’ll take a nap and check back in 4 hours.

  4. According to mlbtr O’s are offering 13M and he’s deciding between Jays and them

  5. i swear to god, if this doesn’t happen I don’t know what I’ll do, but its gonna be sad. tragic

  6. I’d to see them follow up by signing drew. They then would have a team with great infield defense, 3-4 solid #3 pitchers and a good offense. Nobody’s favorite but a team with a shot nonetheless.

  7. while this is a major development, don’t pretend you haven’t seen the first two editions of the Griff Bag

  8. Love to see Reyes start off every game with a 8 or 9 pitch AB even if doesn’t get on base.

  9. This would fit in perfectly with the Jays’ needs.

    A mid-rotation innings eater for a year that won’t block someone like Stroman down the road.

  10. Am I the only one with Yu Darvish déjà vu?

  11. Love the fact that this bumps everyone in the rotation down a spot and guarantees stroman gets work at AAA.

    Happ likely going from 4th starter to the bullpen, AAA or traded. I suspect we’ll hear a trade demand from him soon.

    • Hasn’t happened yet!

      Might just be an agent trying to get orioles or mariners to panic and increaes offer.

  12. And the Orioles have offered incentives, can’t be a good thing.

  13. Hutch lookin good

  14. The only excuse for the Jays to not be able to net him now is if he does not want to play for the Jays and is only using them as leverage to broker a better deal from another club. Otherwise, Jays management is going to have to answer a lot of questions.

    • We’ve actually been pumping this song during workouts over the last couple weeks expecting this very news.

  15. Fuck it’s amazing the good feeling i get watching Hutchison throw strikes instead of watching so many of the Jays pitchers throw all over the place this spring.

  16. Hutchison is a total bawse. He really looks in control out there.

  17. Is it just me, or does Hutchison have the stuff of Morrow with the control of Buerhle?

  18. Sorry, command of Buerhle

  19. Sweet Jesus the Jays better land this guy!

  20. I like the Orioles to spend the extra few million it might take to get him then I do the Jays.

    • Indeed, if it comes to a fight, AA is more likely to say ‘that’s my value, take it or leave it,’ while Orioles more likely to panic and increase.

  21. Anybody consider that by signing with the lesser team who falls out of contention earlier and subsequently trades Santana at the deadline he will no longer come with the compensation pick anchor. Go Jays!

  22. that slider’s none too fucking shabby either. good depth.

  23. That homer by Buxton just made Keith Law wet himself most likely.

  24. If you really want Santana you give him a hand shake that you won’t offer him a QO next year . That outweighed any incentives the orioles offer

  25. Great outing overall. Gave up a homer to the #1 prospect in baseball, meh

  26. His name is Drew Hutchison and he is the Jays’ home opener starting pitcher!!!

  27. Fuck Gose looks seriously shit at the plate this spring.

    • And he’s had what, 2 full seasons at AAA? Hope he doesn’t become a classic AAAA / bench player

      • Maybe, no question he’s got a lot of talent, just wonder if he wasn’t rushed to a certain extent or is still trying to sort himself out. They had him doing so many different things?

        • He could never hit well and he still cant. His prospect potential was all based on him learningto hit which hasnt happened. Funny how often three tool players are called 5 tool. Gose is 3 tool, canthit for contact or power

      • his floor is probably that of major league 4th outfielder though with his speed and defence. the only reason he’s not already in that role in because he’s so young the jays are holding out hope that regular at bats will help him learn to hit. rather than having him waste his possible development time rotting on the bench.

      • Doesn’t he have to actually play well at AAA before we can even call him quad-A?

  28. Drew Hutchinson and John Tavares were separated at birth

    Also Jeff Blair looks like he hung out with Navarro all offseason

  29. Navarro looks really good behind the plate. Quiet, confident, handsome, chunky.

  30. the blue jays really are going to screw this Santana thing up, aren’t they?

  31. And that’s why you pay for a REAL catcher.

    JP doesn’t talk that into a K. Probably doesn’t catch the fucking ball.

  32. Jeff Blair just called the Jays the Expos. Can we start that rumour?

  33. It’s a pretty big swing if Santana ends up in Baltimore rather than Toronto

  34. Hey Santana, sign the fuckin contract.
    I didn’t want you, I’m not sure you’re any good, but sign the thing. Right meow.

    • Lol were like the guy at the bar at the end of the night who ignore the chunky girl in the short dress all night.

      Few hours and half a bottle of whiskey later were begging her to come back to our place.

      Oh baseball you cruel, cruel wench

    • Meow?

      Mew.

      Meh.

  35. That’s some serious bat speed from Jose!

  36. Who is that pro wrestler that just doubled?

  37. That Delabar comment was moronic.

    • What the fuck is that guy smoking? Honestly

    • Jeff Blair expects this years breakout performance to come from reigning all star Steve Delabar. “I just think he is going to play a really big part in the Jays bullpen this year.” And to top it off, he admitted that he has put thought into this.

  38. Andrew Stoeten ‏@AndrewStoeten 41s
    Lord… RT @MaxWildsteinMLB: A rival exec said “From what I’ve heard, (Ervin) Santana will be an Oriole” #Orioles

    Sam:

    …Yep

    • Lol oh boy. I’m avoiding this comment thread for a few weeks if he signs with the orioles

      • gonna be so, so ugly.
        losing this guy over a policy of not offering incentives. sweet fucking christ what a tire fire.

        • Well they could just give him more guaranteed money. Which is stupid because if he wants incentives give it to him

        • It might be over incentives, but who knows at this point? It could actually be because he wants to play for the OriLOLes. Maybe he’s peeved at the way negotiations have gone on with the Jays – when it comes to even money, you might be inclined to choose the team that didn’t dick you around for months.

          • Stop saying things like this. It’s moronic Sam. Seriously, sorry for being a dick but it’s fuckin stupid

            You have no knowledge of the negotiations to this point, and the reality is no one has signed him, so if he feels dicked around he should be mad at 30 teams not just the jays. Be fuckig logical man

            • It’s not moronic. They lowballed him at the start, you think this doesn’t affect your choice? You think that players are automatons that think rationally? These things do affect them. I know you like to take a sabermetric point of view, but for things such as these it is real. Ofcourse, my speculation as just as unbased as your speculation, but it by no means is stupid.

              • No it’s stupid .

                How was it a low ball? Please explain it to me. What offers did he recieve better then the offer he *reportedly* received from the jays

                Oh you don’t know? Then why talk.

                And if the low ball offer is the best offer he received why would he be upset with the jays exactly.

                Jesus get a grip, it’s ridiculously stupid to think any thing you just mentioned is in any way correct

                • Sorry this was a reply to Sam

                  • What’s stupid is how you think this is my feeling or opinion. Whereas I’ve stated now twice that it is speculation, just like when you say it’s the incentives that are driving him towards the OriLOLes. HOWEVER, what I do say is that these things do affect someones decision making. Things like “Do I want to play in this city” “How have I been treated by the team”, however irrational, are things that ceteris paribus (money), players do value.

              • Yeah but Santana HIGHballed everyone (remember $100 MM?) right back and his old team doesnt even want him….bottom line is we don’t know what negotiations have taken place.

      • If it happens this will be worse than the Darvish flap especially for such a little amount of money.

    • Now same guy saying all signs point to him going to Baltimore.

    • Not that it’s fair to the Jays since it’s still Santana’s choice but this would be a hilarious PR disaster going into this season. The Jays would be a consensus pick for last in the East by everyone. Good luck convincing people to come to games early on unless the Jays come out ridiculously hot.

  39. https://twitter.com/andrewstoeten/status/442377571716829184

    Why must they rain on our parade? Fuckers.

    • I just don’t understand what AA is doing, I mean fuck just outbid the orioles. If there’s 14 million available I don’t see how there isn’t 15 or 16 available. I don’t see how they can just let him fall to baltimore and let them get that much better.

  40. Wtf is anthopolous doing? You have an offer on the table that he’ll probably take, and you give him a few hours to shop it?

    Don’t give him the chance to use you as leverage or play you off against another team. Make him choose right now. If he wants to take the gamble that he can get a better deal, then let him go.

    Don’t let yourself be used as a pawn. I have a feeli g he’d take that deal if it was take it or leave it. And if not….its Ervin fucking Santana. Let him walk.

    • But at least if he walked in that scenario, its on AA’s terms and he doesn’t look like an inept fool, which is exactly how he’s going to look if he loses Santana.

  41. So like Ervin Santana just followed me on Twitter, good omen, or is he just getting ready to laugh at me and other Jays fans when the Orioles beat AA’s offer by $1?

  42. “Shit Gumbo” – best phrase I’ve read in a while.

  43. I’m gonna be so pissed if they let him get away over a couple million.

  44. Really hoping this Max Wildstein is the Orioles’ version of Kevin Gray during the Darvish signing

  45. Gose is one of the fastest, worst base stealers I’ve ever seen

  46. All of this uncertainty is making me queasy.

  47. Wait, so the jays are not signing him because of performance incentives? Why is this organization so dumb?

  48. If the Orioles end up with both Jiminez and Santana we will look like an absolute fucking joke. This is absolutely unforgivable given that we let Josh Johnson walk away for nothing. Fuck this organization if this rival exec is accurate

  49. Santana would become a twitter legend if after this weird following spree of Jays and O’s fans he went and signed for the Padres

  50. In my opinion if the Orioles pick up Santana, what this means is that every team in the AL East has aggressively fortified their pitching rotation + their bullpen and the Toronto Blue Jays were stuck on the sidelines preying for Dusty , Romero , Ohko, Rogers, Drabek, Redmon and Happ to magically transform into legit pitchers……. What a joke of an organization no wonder AA is the LOWEST paid GM in proffessional sports.

  51. I am in SRQ ( Sarasota) right now at the hotel where the members of the Orioles Club ( mgmt are staying)

    I spoke to them this morning at breakfast. They were a bit reluctant to talk to me because i was wearing a Blue Jays shirt. The hotel is filled with Orioles fans since the spring training is in Sarasota.

    There are other prominent guests here. AROD etc.

    The orioles staff were bragging about how smart Dan Duquette was . Duquette was an ex expos GM.

    I think the Orioles want Santana more than the Jays.

    This is no BS story & I have the credit card statements to prove which hotel I am saying at..

    I hope the Jays get Santana but…. More later.

  52. 5pm eastern? This is like eating razor blades and then sitting on the toilet reading US Weekly while you wait for them to pass.

  53. Stoeten got a follow too, and sent a please to Santana… A for effort sir!

  54. Should we all follow Santana, throw our dignity away and beg the motherfucker to come? Let’s not kid ourselves, this will knock Happ out of the rotation.

  55. 1994 – Dan Duquette is the GM of arguably the best team in baseball – Monteal Expos

    2004 – Dan Duquette is often given the credit of being the architect of the World Series champions – Boston Red Sox

    2014 – The narrative of Dan Duquette coming up big very 10 years is could be lots of fun if one was to take a flyer on the O’s at 33 to 1. I’ve thrown away $50 on sillier things.

    • Hope you didnt throw away money on preying for Dusty Mccgowan to be named #5 starter, if thats the case maybe you can get your money back from his 1.5MM salary.

      • Narratives, stories, and miracles are what make baseball great.

        I would never abandon that for an actuary experience.

    • The orioles mgmt I spoke to at breakfast this morning knew who Dan duquette was.

  56. The Man from Muncie, folks.

  57. What does Adam Lind think he’s doing hitting off of left handed pitchers?

    • He enjoys giving the coach’s false hope that he can hit lefties, so they give him more at bats. He then turns it into a .200 batting average over too many at bats. 3rd year running.

  58. Does it matter that MLBTR hasn’t updated their Santana post with this latest “development”?

    Who should I believe?

  59. I really hope this is the real thing and not a Melky Mirage.

  60. Santana is basing his decision on Twitter followers.

  61. Why do the Jays have a giant payroll if they aren’t going to try and win it all? The total lack of addressing this team’s issues is mind boggling.

  62. Stoeten suuuuuper but hurt right now because his entire life revolves around the Jays

    • Most of us expect/want the blog admin on this blue jays blog to give a shit about the blue jays

      What would be annoying if he didn’t get worked up. Why are you here?

    • I love that people might actually seriously think this.

  63. Geez, that’s quite the carcass on the fan with the yellow cup.

  64. Don’t know why but this is some of the most painful waiting I’ve had to do regarding the Jays. Maybe because with Darvish/Tanaka all the big BIG BIG names seemed like such a pipe dream that expectatins & hopes were not that high. But when we’re talking about a #4 starter in ES, this one seems to hurt a lot more if we let him slip through our fingers to the Orioles.

    I think that’s what will make it hurt the most, Baltimore legitimately improved their rotation in the offseason, while AA pissed in our mouths and did pretty much nothing. Don’t say I’m overreacting. I am aware ES is nothing special, but, Jesus Christ…we need SOME improvement for the 2014 season. The rotation as it stands will not cut it.

  65. Angry hungover Stoeten is the best Stoeten

  66. Step back from the ledge Stoeten, it’s Ervin fucking Santana.

    • No it’s actually JA Happ and Drew Hutchison…

    • Ervin fucking Santana is a good bit better than Esmil fucking Rogers, Todd fucking Redmond or JA fucking Happ.

      • Subjective. Those guys combined are paid a fraction of what Santana would get, and Santana is just covered with red flags.

    • The player is immaterial to what’s so fucked up about this.

      • I don’t want to poke the bear here, but what’s so fucked up about this? AA has a price he’s willing to pay for Santana. We have argued back and forth as to whether Santana is worth spending the extra money on relative the the wins we may gain from him over say Hutch or Happ. If he ends up on the Jays, great. If not, it’s not like we missed out on Darvish again.

        • Be serious.

          • Sorry, I’m on my phone. Are you asking me to be serious?

            • Yes.

              • I’m not being deliberately obtuse about this, but what is so fucked up about this situation? Seriously, it’s Santana. I really don’t think he’s the last piece to push the Jays into the playoffs. Just my opinion. I could, and am likely wrong, but we won’t know until the games are played and we pore over the stats.

                • Don’t know if my support will hurt your point but I agree with your asessment.

                • It’s fucked because you can’t just decide on a value for a pitcher and stick with it. At some point you have to reevaluate value based on market conditions. If I value a new car at $5,000, I can stick to my principles and wait for a car that only costs $5,000, or I can decide that since everybody else values cars at a higher rate, maybe I should reevaluate my $5,000 determination or I’m never getting a new car.

                  It’s also especially fucked because, if Happ actually is hurt (or shitty), Santana saves the Jays a bundle by allowing them to keep Stroman in the minors until the Super 2 date has passed. In other words, a portion (not sure how much) of Santana’s salary can be cancelled out by the savings you get by delaying Stroman’s arbitration date.

                • Stupid policies possibly getting in the way of a relatively cheap improvement to the team is what’s fucked up with this situation.

                  • I’m not sold on Santana being an improvement on what we’ve got. I’m on my way to Cuba. I’ll see if I can fit a Cuban or two into my suitcase.

                    Andrew, you’ll be pleased to know that as of 4:20 I will not be commenting. I may not know what happened until next week. If we get Santana, I hope he’s better than I expect. If we don’t, I hope he goes crazy during an Orioles/Red Sox game and pulls out an Uzi.

        • Santana now willing to take a 1-year deal at the same QO the jays would have paid JJ is akin to him literally falling into our lap; yet AA risks him going to a division rival over incentives or a marginal increase.

          Beeston and AA should be fired if Baltimore gets him for marginally more than the $14M we apparently offered

        • Well AA should go down to wal mart and pick up a pitcher that is priced to his satisfaction.

      • “The player is immaterial to what’s so fucked up about this.”

        I disagree. It’s very un-immaterial. At the end of the day, if the Jays decide that Santana isn’t worth more than 14MM, is that really so terrible?

        • You can’t always get what you want at the price you want. Would the Jays go and sign a legit ace for $20 Million a year right now if they could? Yes, so would 29 other teams.

          • I just think they’re probably less eager to throw money around for a guy who had a Romero-esque season two years ago, gives up a shitload of homers and whose arm might fall off at any minute.

        • Yes.

        • Yeah it’s fucking terrible. A one year deal? Fuck yeah!! It’s a pitcher that is clearly a better option than the rest.
          I am generally an optimistic fan, against all intraweb wisdom I even believe that there is a chance that this team could shock the world with some fortune or breaks… But if the Jays let a division rival come in and steal their date at last call and not fight back. I dunno man, that’s pretty fucking terrible.

    • Stoeten’s reacting like the fan boys he hates.
      Good to see him get emotional about the team.
      Makes him seem human.

      • Nice to see you’re still a moron, RADAR. Your idiocy is my lighthouse in these rough waters.

        • “Your idiocy is my lighthouse in these rough waters.”

          … You need more beer.

        • I am the beacon and shall lead the way through the darkness, in this, your time of need.
          Seeing that your anger is clouding your judgement. I’m just glad to help.
          We’ll all find out in the next 2 hours,so let’s wait and see.

      • You guys should just kiss and get it over with. So much tension.
        P.s. Please don’t ban me.

    • “Step back from the ledge, it’s Ervin fucking Santana”

      I agree with this 100%. Signing Santana to a 1 year contract would be nice, but if it doesn’t happen, it’s not as big of a deal as a lot of you are making it out to be. I also don’t think his signing will push this team into a playoff position, that scenario will only happen if current players have break out seasons.

      • dude, you’re forgetting that we’ve already been here this off-season with Tanaka and Jimenez and been similarly bossed out of a deal for similar bullshit reasons. Not getting Santana – especially after we’re right in the same situation we were in with Tanaka and Jimenez (even possibly more so this time) – would mean we’re akin to a limp noodle when it comes to negotiating high priced talent, which is a pretty big deal for a supposed winning ballclub.

  67. If this disintegrates over incentive bonuses, media leaks, the way the agent went about it or any amount of money that isn’t SIGNIFICANT, it’s proof positive IMO that Alex can’t hack it when it comes to MLB level talent acquisition.

    Take whatever your extra bullpen piece makes, get it the hell off the roster by any means and improve your ballclub. You’re acquiring a horse that puts the bats in the hands of the pretty damn decent offense you’ve constructed. Every team-friendly deal, declined signing bonus and passed on Free Agent has been squirreled away for something like this.

    Coming away from this situation empty handed after waiting all summer for the market to come to him isn’t an option. I will be legitimately upset as a fan. Santana has to be moved on today. No excuses.

    • It wouldn’t be proof of his inability to hack it at all.

      • Certainly would for me when it comes to the open market.

        His comments about being uncomfortable with ‘overpaying’ Navarro sat pretty poorly with me. I like plenty of what he’s done and the roster is good, but the holes in the rotation are glaring the point where a solution should have been found already. To have this one year deal fall into his lap and not capitalise would fall absolutely flat with me almost regardless of reason.

  68. Who is this Max guy?

  69. I should learn not to be surprised by anything AA does. Anyone who’s read Davidi and Lott’s book knows that AA essentially called off the Marlins deal because of Jeff fucking Mathis before being told Beeston would kill him.

  70. Whatever happens boys, let’s stick together. We are all Jays fans here.

    If he signs with the Jays, fucking great.

    If he signs with the O’s, let’s hope his fucking arm falls off.

  71. I’m a Blue Jays fan, and a Canucks fan. This week has been brutal.

  72. Just in case, what’s the opposite of a Ninja?

  73. Do you think that Kawasaki just broke what might be the world’s only asics bat?

  74. Love the Press Club on Dundas.

  75. I don’t know if I can go on living….

  76. Keep Moises Sierra.

  77. I like Stilson too and Drabek wasn’t horrible today.

  78. Half a season of Santana for 14 million before his elbow blows up? I wouldn’t be heartbroken to lose out on this guy. Jimenez was the guy we already lost out on. To have a GM identify two key positions that need to be filled and then do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about it in the offseason is pretty damned frustrating.

    I just may have to start a BYOB policy at games this summer. If they wont spend their money, I wont spend mine (aside from the tickets I’ve actually paid for already).

    • Yep because he’s such a huge gamble injury wise compared to guys like Morrow, Drabek and Hutchison who are perfect examples of hardiness and durability.

      • Can anyone explain to me how all of a sudden Santana is a huge injury risk right after the season he throws 200 plus innings?

        • “Whatever is in Santana’s medical history about his right elbow ligament scares the heck out of teams. The fact that Santana is tied to draft-pick compensation has hurt him, but the bigger problem for him — and the reason why the $100 million-plus request on his behalf had absolutely no chance of happening — is that teams are scared of his elbow blowing out soon. Some team evaluators have said there’s no way they’d invest significant money in a player who appears to be that close to a major blowout.

          Those fears are exacerbated by the fact that Santana threw highest percentage of sliders in 2013 of any pitcher in the majors, a pitch that is notoriously tough on elbows.”

          • Ahhh, sliders…I see. Thanks Pecan. I seem to remember cutters being a tough pitch on elbows roo.

      • They’re obviously not, but why would the team drop 14 million on a player that *might* make it through an entire season? Jimenez was the better option out of the two and the Jays already shit the bed on him to a division rival. Adding any additional talent to a roster that’ll be competitive IF everyone is able to stay healthy is pretty damned redundant if that talent is destined for the DL.

        • Id rather have Santana for one year than Jimenez for four.

        • Maybe because the team didn’t want to go 4 years on a free agent starter that wasn’t a proven #1 or #2.

          I think the only reason the Jays are even in on Santana is the limited term.

          • How many #1 or #2 pitchers were on the FA market again? It was a shitty offseason to get pitchers but, given the investments already made…

            Brilliant analytical skills on identifying the Jays interest. Brilliant.

    • I didn’t/don’t want either of Ubaldo or Ervin for four years. I do not believe the Jays ‘lost’ out on him. Maybe they did miss out in the long run? But I have a hard time believing that, I’m with AA – the weaponless ninja – if he says the price did not match the product.

      I’m really liking what I see from hutch. He is passing the eye test for me, I don’t remember him as a guy in the mid-90s tho?? Not saying he’s a stud after 5ip but from what I saw today there’s reason not to get excited by what I watched today. I hope he is a rare long overdue pleasant surprise for Jays fans.

  79. In Stilson, there is someone that make guys like Janssen and Santos are good trade bait eventually.

    • Janssen should have been trade bait last year. I sure as hell don’t want the Jays re-signing him to a “closer premium” deal after this year with his injury history and age.

      • Can almost count on it not happening unless all the guys in the pen get injured.

      • Santos will likely be the closer next year; paying Janssen closer money with Santos around would be silly

        • I just wish the Jays found a trade for Janssen since I’d prefer they just let him walk after this year unless he, for some reason, agrees to a 1-year deal.

          • I had a good chuckle when young Gideon Turk said that Janssen would get a QO from the Jays this coming winter. Maybe 5 years ago when teams paid closers like kings but not anymore imo. Kimbrel didn’t even get $14 million a year in his new deal.

          • The guy’s done everything they asked of him (including rebounding successfully from labrum surgery) for a zillion years. He’s one of the most loyal Jays. If he’s still getting people out I say pay him fair market value.

  80. I hate Beeston and his policies of not giving out incentives when it could be the difference between getting a FA or not. I could be wrong, but that is a stubborn rule to have

  81. Is anybody else feeling like the disillusioned fan played by Randy Quaid in Major League?

  82. Lol sorry can’t resist. Kenny Wilson ladies and gents. See I even got his name right this time.

  83. Kenny Wilson! Career highlight! Watch out Colby Rasmus!

  84. Another hour.
    Tick tick tick

  85. Is this so called deadline 4:00pm CST or EST?

  86. And here I thought it was going to be a regular calm day at work for me. Nope. Refreshing mlbtraderumours every 5 minutes with foolish hope.

  87. I have followed and loved the Blue Jays for all 34 years of my life. They are the only team in any sport that I have stuck by through thick and thin. I have stood behind them through Sirotka, Loaiza, Luke MOTHERFUCKIN’ Prokopec and many other bonehead moves. I already have tickets to a game on April 5 vs. the Yankees, but if we lose out on Ervin “I may not be great, but I’m better that Fuckin’ Happ” Santana I’m going to lose my Fuckin’ mind. Especially if it’s to the Motherfuckin’ Orioles and once again due to our moronic, self-imposed, Brian Burke-esque policies. If that happens, Anthopoulos and Beeston should be fired immediately. Let them go run the Flames with Burkie. I don`t wanna give up on this team, but if they fuck this up, I may take a 6 month sabbatical from this utter fucking stupidity.

    Sincerely,

    A Jays fan who can`t handle this motherfuckin` horseshit any longer

  88. Not a bad weekend for the site. Probably going to get 1000+ comments by the time it’s all done, especially the few hundred of outrage sure to follow if that Wildstein fellow is correct.

  89. Per @Enrique_Rojas1, Ervin Santana will sign a one-year, $14M deal with the Blue Jays if he doesn’t get a better offer by 5pm. Suspense!

    — Bruce Arthur (@bruce_arthur) March 8, 2014

  90. when I left to go to my son’s hockey game, I had just heard that the jays had signed Santana… And then I come home to this. WTF?

  91. If Santana really does have potential health issues, I’d be shocked to see him sign a smaller contract with incentives. Wouldn’t make sense to go after incentives if you’re probably going to be spending a bit of time on the DL.

  92. They say Santana is tweeting quotes from Oriole pitching great Earl Weaver; cant be a good sign

  93. I’m guessing Santana has a social media team not unlike Joseph Bats (perhaps even the same people) that follows and favourites random twitter users who mention Ervin Santana – for obvious reasons such tweets are highly clustered among Jays and O’s fans today.

  94. Usual moron on JaysTalk. Don’t know how Wilner does it

  95. Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 3m

    Jose Bautista confirmed to me that he, like Ervin Santana, is now represented by agent Jay Alou, who recently resigned from Proformance.
    Expand

    And the plot potentially thickens lol

    • It doesn’t matter if his agent is Bean Stringfellow, Jay Alou or Dustin Parkes. I think we’re past the point of the agent doing anything that makes a difference. He’s going where he gets the most money on a 1-year deal.

  96. Jon Morosi ‏@jonmorosi 5m
    Jose Bautista confirmed to me that he, like Ervin Santana, is now represented by agent Jay Alou, who recently resigned from Proformance.

  97. Let me guess, you’re a virgin and you live in your parent’s basement. Am I close?

  98. So which bar in downtown Toronto are we hitting to either celebrate or commiserate ?

  99. Apologies but, up here in Canadia, we don’t fuck our mothers.

    Enjoy living with the traits of inbreeding.

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