Game Threat: Jays @ Cleveland

So… yesterday sucked. Obviously. But you want to know what sucks more? Listening to fucking hopeless idiots trying to make a mountain out of two losses on a 162 game schedule for a team currently at .500 who everybody figured would end up somewhere about ten games above or below .500 by the time all is said and don’t. Yeah, Gibbons left Dickey in a batter or two too long and it bit him. It happens. If it helps inform the manager in making a hard decision the next time he contemplates having Dickey on a shorter leash than he believes the pitcher would like, then there’s some positive there. Way more negative than positive, but still. Also, as much as the little pisspantses rushing to Twitter to vent about Noah Syndergaard don’t want to hear this: it’s early. There is no reason to think that Dickey won’t get better than what we’ve seen. Look at what he did when healthy in the second half of last season, and in 2012. These four games haven’t looked good, but they don’t undo that (you whining fucking morons).

And last night’s game? Yeah, it was a bullpen meltdown of epic proportions. Yeah, you could nitpick Gibbons for taking Delabar out too early, or pretend like Santos wasn’t trying, or something, in order to justify all the little negativity you want to hurl through your TV and computer screens, but… I dunno… maybe try being a goddamn human being for once and recognize that the Jays tried to hold a lead with their two best relievers and it just didn’t work, which is a thing that happens sometimes. Look around you: most people can actually do this just fine, and just because your insufferably fucking whiny voice is loud enough doesn’t mean you’re not kinda dumb as shit and blind to what a little child you’re actually being. OK?

Now let’s never speak of it again.

Comments (826)

  1. Yes…Bill James wrote Moneyball…thanks “manalyst”….

    • Fucking hilarious. Yes, the same Bill James who hosted the Oscars. Oh wait, that was James Franco.

  2. Gregg’s Easter pastels are nice.

  3. Bill James wrote “Moneyball” everybody. Gregg Zaun said it, so it must be true. *double facepalm*

  4. Give Lawrie another 2 weeks and he will be under .100
    .200 is the Mendoza line, what is .100 called?

  5. Wicki to the rescue:

    The cutoff point is most often said to be .200,[1] and, when a position player’s batting average falls below that level, the player is said to be “below the Mendoza Line”. This is often thought of as the offensive threshold below which a player’s presence in Major League Baseball cannot be justified, regardless of his defensive abilities.

  6. In all honesty, we’d have won this game if Navarro had been catching. But then I guess you can’t make your starting catcher start every game.

  7. I say let navarro run for himself. He’s a proven base stealing threat.


    HAHA Cleveland rules sometimes.

  9. Is that an Indians fan doing the Braves arm chop?

  10. That girlie in the Browns tank top is my type i think

  11. Worst thing about this days old thread is the sad picture of Derek Bell.

  12. 8 hits in the series for Melky, no big deal.

  13. Alright Edwin, I haven’t gone for a walk in a while. We’re both due.

  14. Single ties it. Cmon Eddie.

  15. I guess it’s possible Edwin might walk.

  16. Come on, EE.
    Get the monkey off your back and the parrot back on your shoulder.

  17. Green light here?

  18. Ump bails out Axford.

  19. Axford looks like a snake, flashing his tongue like that.

  20. Damn.

  21. BS strike zone.

  22. Fuck. Can’t blame Edwin on that one. Hit it hard.

    Kind of wish this team could sweep a series or two. Early, but annoying.

    • Eerily similar to the first game of the series… the baseball gods giveth, the baseball gods taketh away

  23. Well, winning a series is never a bad thing.

    • Exactly. Let’s take something positive out of this! Disappointing Loup outing, but they played pretty well otherwise.

  24. I would love to shove that drum up someone’s ass…

  25. Cue the trolls

  26. That was clearly ball 4 you stupid fucking ump

  27. Fuckin’ Gogol Bordello tiptoes for a lucky save

  28. Well before I have to leave this team for the Sahara I just wanna say how excited I am for this year;

    The pitching is not good, but the regression due from cy young leader buehrle should be offset by dickey not being terrible. Morrow… I dunno. Might be what he is, but that’s bearable in a number 4.

    The hitting is awesome. Melky looks right, Jose thinks it’s 2011. Once eddy remembers how to hit we will be dangerous.

    To think that this time last year, Drew was already saying we were fucked. This year, legit playoff chances with this squad.

    Go jays

  29. It does really say something about the Blue Jays this year that I can watch a close game like this + actually think they are going to come back + win. Like, it actually seems like a possibility. In the past…not so much.

  30. Ahh we took the series.

    Something to lighten the mood.

  31. Once again – FINISH THE DAMN JOB when you’ve got the chance!

    • Yeah but teams don’t automatically win the game when they go 2 runs up. Shit happens.

      They “finished the damn job” the previous two games.

      • But with a little luck and attention to detail – they’d have another 3-4 wins.
        Let’s look back in September and see how much they could use those “shoulda closed the deal” wins.

        • And sometimes that doesn’t happen. You understand that they can’t magically make it happen, right?

        • This sort of “they could have X more wins if so-and-so” reasoning just doesn’t work. If the ball gets by Edwin on Friday, that win turns into a loss. Today Edwin smashed a ball right at the second baseman to end the game. And those are just the plays that come to mind because they happened to be decisive. There are so fucking many little moments in a game where the momentum can shift dramatically on the finest of margins.

          You can’t just add/subtract wins in a vacuum. If the Jays miss the playoffs it’ll because they just weren’t good enough, not because they lost one game in Cleveland in mid April.

          • This.

          • Bang on Bob.

          • I’m not going to hang a missed playoff appearance on a lost game in Cleveland.
            What I’m saying is that the Jays seem to have displaced a historical propensity for NOT getting the job done when an opportunity presents itself.
            Good teams make you pay for your mistakes. Good teams take advantage of situations.
            The Jays have – for an infuriatingly long time, it seems – have meekly left an inning where the game-changer was there for the taking…only to either lose the game outright by allowing the opposition to peck away – or have the game turn into a sphincter-tightening nail-biter in the ninth.
            I know the guys are TRYING…I’m not a total douchebag by saying they’re not. But I’m saying there’s a certain element of ruthlessness that good teams demonstrate CONSISTENTLY… essence of “oh god, we’re in the shit now” that certain teams instill in the opposition – something I really don’t feel when you’re playing the Jays.
            That’s a learned trait. That’s something that you put on your own shoulders after you’ve hammered a coffin shut a few times by taking advantage of situations in the late innings.
            Just my 2 cents worth of observation after being a fan since Day One.

  32. What is going on with Loup? 7 walks in 8 2/3? Yikes. He threw 13 over 69 1/3 last year. Is he is facing more righties than he used to?

    I just hope he got the implosion bug out of his system.

    Same goes for Happ the other night, but I fear we won’t be so lucky with him.

  33. I dont understand this sentiment of “well we won the series so its all good”

    series are meaningless. Each game is its own individual event with its own value, no greater or lesser than any other game.

    so the first two games of the series have no bearing as to the value of this game.

    this is now the second game in 4 in which the pen allowed a team to score 3 or more runs in an inning on 1 hit.

    in those two fateful innings, jays pitchers have allowed 9 runs on two hits.

    that is laughably bad and has resulted in essentially giving away two games.

    i dont know if its going to be a trend, but I dont like the trend.

  34. Two of the three losses would have been wins with a major league manager in the dugout.

    • The problem with statements like this is you’re assuming the manager KNEW his normally excellent reliever was going to shit the bed and not correct himself and left him in because he personally hates you and every other fan of your given team. It was one bad inning. It happens. That’s why you play the games.

    • And of the other games, when the pen was used effectively? Or do those not count?

    • It’s a lot easier to manage a pen when your starters go 7+…relievers are occasionally going to give up runs.

      Santos wasn’t ready in minny and there have been some quibbles here and there, but keep in mind that he has to consistently navigate a minefield.

  35. Morrow. 5 innings. Ouch.

    • He was pretty wild today. He was lucky to make it through those five with as little damage as he did give up.

      • He still only gave up 3 hits + 2 walks. I think Gibbons was just quick to pull him since the pen was well rested.

        He did seem to have trouble finishing guys off which led to long at-bats.

        His FIP and strikeout numbers so far are excellent.

  36. Here is what was most annoying to me. Its not that they blew the game with walks. Its not that Morrow could only go five freaking innings.

    Its that they had TWO outs and nobody on and allowed three runs to score. wonder what the run expectancy is there?

    to make matters worse, you had lefty loup on the mound vs lefty brantley with an 0-2 count….and then brantley goes into his best tony gwynn impersonation and works a walk.

    so freaking annoying. hate losing games like that.

    • What, teams never have 2-out rallies now? Come on.

      It’s frustrating as hell, but it happens.

    • I also hate losing games like that. It sucks.

      Still, we can’t make any conclusions based on these outlier innings. One day, Mark Whiten hit four HRs in a game…

      Baseball man

  37. HEY!!!! Mark Whiten was friggin awesome….remember when he beat up jack McDowell?
    The. Greatest.

  38. Whiten had one of the greatest outfield arms I’ve ever seen.

  39. Who sucks more? Gibbons or Lawrie?

  40. Its been a whacky start to the season. A’s are on a nice little 11-2 run
    while the Astros are sporting a nasty 3-11 record in recent starts.

    Seems like every other team, including our local heroes,
    have been playing the elevator game: looking like champs one day
    and chumps the next. Some of the changes have come within games:
    improbable comebacks and mystifying meltdowns.

    Texas whacks Chicago 12-0 on Friday and gets beat 16-2 today.
    Did the teams switch uniforms and not tell anybody?

    Eddie is one of the worst hitters in the AL: along with those usual stiffs
    Carlos Santana, Miguel Cabrera, Prince Fielder and several others.

    Point is, we can’t read too much into anything at this point of the season.
    Give it another six weeks and see where things sit at the end of May.
    By that time, we should have a better idea on the prospects
    both for individuals and the team.

    In the mean time, put on your seat belt and buckle up.

  41. really hard to get upset at guys like loup or delabar for blowing games when they’ve been fucking fantastic for us .

    shit happens.

    I’d like someone to figure out why and how batters are able to foul off so many of his pitches.

  42. this team is not good. 4 hitters can’t even hit .200. only 1 starter can go 5 innings. bullpen walking everyone. they’ve just gotten away with it so far because of weak teams. buerhle is 4-0 and rest is 6-9 and we know buerhle won’t keep this up so do the math.

    • So you think thats a trend that will continue?
      That at the AS break 4 players won’t hit over 200 and Buehrle will regress but at the same time, the rest of the starters will remain the same or worsen?
      That if what you say actually happens, that AA won’t make any changes?
      All this when the Jays are one game out of first, so there’s no hope?

      Guess you got it all figured out ( mathematically speaking) so the only thing left to do for you is to cheer for the Orioles. There 8 and 9 , in last place but are poised to make a move towards a penant.
      Nice knowing ya.
      I’ll watch the Jays.
      I bleed fucking blue and will watch Melky continue to hit,Jbau lead the league in walks and homeruns,EE come out of his funk,Reyes be the true lead off player that every other team covets.

      • what changes do you think he could make. the cavalry aint coming. goins/sierra can’t hit and rasmus/lawrie are not proven hitters that are just slumping. just because other teams are playing bad is not a logical argument for the jays playing bad.

        there’s nothing to indicate the other 4 starters will dominate and we know buerhle is not a .86 era pitcher.

        and you really think AA will send goins and lawrie down? not in a million years! and good luck releasing sierra, gotta hide those assets!

  43. In the hypothetical situation, if Lawrie is still hitting in the .150 range come June, then what do they do with him?

    • I’m not sure what they can do. There’s no internal replacements. Drew would make a lot of sense, but in the scenario where Lawrie hits .150 the Jays then have 2 holes on the infield to fill.

    • It’s not happening. His floor is a league-average-ish hitter with moderate power and plus defense. Miles better than any internal replacement.

      • That is not his floor just described lawries potential

        • He did just that in his worst season (2013). I think he has too much talent to be much worse, but maybe I’m wrong.

          He flashed superstar potential in his rookie season and he’s still only 24. Not everyone is like Mike Trout.

  44. I can be as critical on the Jays as anyone, but overall, I’ve been pleased with the team so far. You can’t win the pennant in April, but you can lose it (or at least come close) and they aren’t doing that, even with some injuries, some key guys not hitting, and the starters not being great (save buerhle). As for the pen, everybody’s allowed a bad night or two. Loup, Santos, Delbar, etc. has been pretty solid for a few years now, but they aren’t perfect. I’d only be concerned if the occasional hiccup starts becoming an every opening problem.

  45. Francisco looks like a player.

    Overall, a 5-4 record on the road trip and 10-9 overall while playing 13 of 19 on the road. Could be worse.

    Bring on the Sux.

    • I agree. 6-5 on the road without Reyes is not too bad.

      I’d like to think the Delabar/Santos/Happ and Loup incidents were just hiccups. And that Morrow still needs to shake off rust from not starting since last May.

      • Morrow’s ERA really doesn’t reflect how well he’s thrown the ball so far. He hasn’t really been terrible in any of his starts (maybe against Minny, but everyone sucked in that series). He’s striking out a ton of guys and not walking too many, with a tidy 3.04 xFIP. His rust, as you say, is resulting in some really long at-bats that inflate his pitch count.

        I thought he was pretty good for the most part on Sunday. Gibby probably had him on a short leash because of the rested bullpen + day off.

        • I dont think Morrow has been great. Hes been ok. He needs to be way more efficient and go deeper into games. It seems like once he gets to two strikes, he cant finish batters off.

          • He hasn’t been great, but there are still a lot of positives to take from his performances so far. Especially given how much of a question mark he was coming into the season.

            Which you can’t say about Dickey, unfortunately. He’s been terrible.

          • more than anything he’s just not a command pitcher, and that’s the main reason why he has a tendency serve up dingers, lose the strikezone occasionally and has trouble making it through 6 innings despite his high quality stuff.

            he’s pretty effective, but he’s no innings eater, and he probably never will be.

            • Well said. If he can put up 160 innings or so with an ERA in the high 3′s, that’d be pretty great. I’m not sure his command is good enough to ever be a true “ace” but his stuff is lights-out.

  46. The RAD trade was a complete disaster, anyone with half a brain and a set of balls can admit this to be true. He can’t hack it in the AL, plain and simple. He can’t pitch effectively in the dome and he’s been figured out… The smart thing to do would be to move him around June and try to get a pitcher back in the deal or go after Sjamrdza… but AA has tied himself to RAD… Aren’t we glad AA didn’t go after Santana eh…LOL

    And Andrew, try to relax a bit bud, don’t take fans criticism of the team so hard…. The rotation is dog shit, you defending it won’t change that from being true.

    • So far the Dickey trade has gone pretty poorly, it is true, though there’s no way Dickey finishes the year at a 6.26 ERA.

      And as awesome as Syndergaard is, let’s not forget he’s putting up a 2-2, 4.95, 1.55WHIP line right now in AAA.

      If that line by Syndergaard is too small a sample size, then so also is the Dickey line. No, Dickey probably isn’t going to throw up a 2.95ERA Cy Young award winning season, but he’s not finishing above 6.00 ERA either, when last season he was at a respectable, if mediocre, 4.21.

    • The rotation is 6th in the AL in ERA, but yeah, keep peddling your narrative.

    • The problem here is that everything you say is poorly-reasoned bullshit.

  47. The Brandon Morrow we saw yesterday is the Brandon Morrow I’d like to see going forward. I know we’d all like to see him go 7+ innings, but it’s hard to complain with 5 innings of 2-run ball. As infuriating as it may be to watch him go 0-2 on a batter and still need 6+ pitches to finish him off, there are other players who are far more deserving of some early backlash.

    Assuming the injuries lessen for the Jays in the coming weeks, this team very well could be one that’s dangerous with the likes of Janssen and Lind (did I really just say that?) back.

    Gibbons has been nearly great so far. Some of his decisions haven’t panned out, but it’s not his fault that relievers are occasionally allergic to the strike-zone. I mean, if they take medication for this, they likely will be suspended 50-games. The only gripe I have with Gibbons is why he’s constantly running Goins out onto the field. The dude can barely make contact, and his fielding seems fairly average early on. Diaz should be seeing some playing time at 2B and let him try to run off with the job.

    While the Jays could be 12-7 if you give wins to their two recent meltdowns, shit happens in baseball, they’re 10-9, they could be much worse, and are only 1 game back while still in April. Compared to last season, I think we should all be pleased with what results we have witnessed so far.

  48. I have been better entertained this April than last, so I will take that above anything else.

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