Is Gibbons’ Job In Jeopardy?


“Anthopoulos not tipping hand on Gibbons’ status” reads the headline from a piece published Tuesday evening at by Gregor Chisholm, and… wait, what? Gibbers is in trouble???

John Gibbons, as you may be aware, has a contract that automatically adds an extra year to his deal every January 1st. That, according to the GM, is apparently all you need to know about whether he’ll be back.

“He’s under contract,” Anthopoulos said when asked if he was going to take care of the situation. “He’s always under contract, pretty much. I don’t think there’s anything to take care of and I think he has done a good job.”

Oh. Well that doesn’t sound so bad. Much ado about nothing, right?

Er… hold on a second. There’s more.

“He’s under contract,” Anthopoulos reiterated. “I’ve said this before, I’m a big believer that no matter what position — grounds crew, administrative assistant, manager, coach — you support them until you don’t support them.

“Until they’re no longer in this position, you support them. That position is going to be that way — whether you’re 100 games over .500 or we’re struggling. We always support our staff.”

So Anthopoulos supports Gibbons?

“Every employee,” Anthopoulos said. “I wouldn’t make anything more of this.”

Yeah… so that’s definitely a bit odd. What’s more, as Gregor pointed out on Twitter, the comments are considerably different than what Anthopoulos said in response to similar questions last year.

From on Agosto 27, 2013:

“There’s never been any thought in that respect at all,” Anthopoulos said when asked if Gibbons will be returning.

“John is our manager, and we expect him to be. But I understand what the response is. When you’re not playing well as a team, these are the things that happen. You talk about the GM, the manager, you talk about the players … people want a reason, and changes usually come when players aren’t playing well and teams aren’t performing. I think that comes with the territory.”

. . .

“I actually think [regarding] the in-game managing, he has done a great job,” Anthopoulos said of Gibbons. “I think it’s so easy to pin results on one person. I think it’s convenient. I could say that for myself. I could say that for certain players, for the manager. I just don’t think blame falls on one person.

“When we’re playing the way we have, I just don’t think it falls on one person; it’s collectively. There’s blame to share — that’s probably the best way to put it. I just don’t believe it’s one thing, and that’s the issue.”

I like what 2013 Anthopoulos had to say a whole lot better. He maybe wasn’t entirely full-throated in his vote of confidence, but it’s a long way from “you support them until you don’t support them.” In fact, what he said on Tuesday was uncomfortably reminiscent of the comments he made as John Farrell’s tenure was winding down, telling reporters that a manager’s contract simply sets his rate of compensation, the implication being that it was irrelevant whether or not Farrell was going into a “lame duck” year — so irrelevant, apparently, that they needed to structure Gibbons’ contract so as to entirely avoid the issue. *COUGH*

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This sure sorta feels like it, doesn’t it? I hate to be negative, and there’s still mathematically a chance, but losing four of five since they swept the lowly Cubs hasn’t lost the Jays a whole lot of ground, but they’ve lost a whole lot of precious time to make up the 5.5 games they currently sit behind the Kansas City Royals. The Royals are currently down to the shitty White Sox, but even so, with just twelve games left… y’know.

And so now we’re seeing the kids. Dan Norris pitched an inning tonight — not particularly well, but he was in there! And what do we expect from a kid who isn’t used to pitching out of the bullpen, and has been sitting around for as long as Norris has? Not a whole lot. Graveman pitched, as well, and Dalton Pompey even got an at-bat. So… that’s something. I guess.

The whole “let’s see what the kids have got” thing sure feels a lot better with just a couple weeks to go than it does with multiple months to go, at least. Less so, maybe, when it’s a glimpse of a potentially very real, and potentially very frustrating future, as in Kevin Pillar flailing away — not that his manager did him a lot of favours in his , though he actually had a walk to go with his two strikeouts tonight. Or Anthony Gose. Or Ryan Goins.

Heading into tonight Pillar had a .304 on-base since his recall, with a 1.8% walk rate and strikeout rate above 23%. Since the start of August, against big league pitching, Anthony Gose had slashed .193/.242/.263. Prior to tonight, in September, Ryan Goins had slashed .152/.176/.273.

Isn’t defence great?

Ugh. I don’t know. I don’t know…

Hey, and more beanballs and the O’s clinching the AL East in front of us. What a night, eh?

Though Ian nails it: at least Jose at least did it right:

The Oriole Bird

Everything. About. This.

Hey! It’s the Jays and O’s! Playing baseball! Or… something.

The Jays probably want to win this one, FYI.

Yeah, I got nothing.

Except this: Baltimore’s mascot is called The Oriole Bird. The fuck? Tautology much?

Also: Kawasaki? Really?


Image via.


“To prove anything can, and will, happen… My unused 1987 #BlueJays playoff tix. 3.5 up with 7 to play. #162games” – @Section524

I’m in no mood to write a eulogy for the 2014 Blue Jays this afternoon, but that certainly feels like it’s probably in order. Maybe I say so a bit prematurely — all the “anything can happen” caveats still apply, it’s just pissing away three of their last four has made what was already a near impossible task even tougher.

“Pissed away” is a little unfair, of course. This is baseball, and even the best teams lose all the time. The Jays are 10-5 in their last fifteen, which is a great run by any measure, but they have left themselves with so little margin for error that any time they’ve crossed over to the bad side of that line it’s been as screamingly obvious as it’s been utterly deflating.

But I don’t want to give up hope yet! Even as trying to muster it feels increasingly more futile. (I also don’t particularly want to write about last night’s next most deflating moment: Marcus Stroman throwing at the head of Caleb Joseph. That was pure stupidity on Stroman’s part, but what bothers me more than him doing it — because I understand the dugout politics involved make it difficult for a rookie to make a stand against the culture he needs to exist in — is the people who condone it or, worse still, say “at least aim for the ribs,” as though that’s fucking excusable. All this bullshit gets presented under the rubric of the code, and “being a man,” and not looking weak, but it’s bloody obvious what’s actually the “manly” reaction here. To stand up and say, “This is fucking stupid you dumb meat head fucks.” All of it. You don’t throw at people. And you certainly don’t cower behind this horseshit tradition because you’re afraid people will call you weak or will pull the “never played the game” card. Let’s be better than that.)

So… uh… yeah. Here are the improbable things we’re hoping to see happen this week!

Jays @ Orioles

Mariners @ Angels
Well this is a pretty easy one too. The Mariners have four against the best team in baseball, and already lost the first game of the set last night. Nothing really to contemplate here — the Angels have clinched a playoff spot, and Seattle is the only team between the Jays and the holders of the second Wild Card spot, the Royals. Go halos.

White Sox @ Royals
The Royals host the shitty White Sox. COME ON, SHITTY WHITE SOX! They at least have to face Chris Sale on Wednesday. But all is not lost even if Kansas City takes the next two or three with Chicago — provided the Jays get back to winning, that is — as the Royals host Detroit on the weekend, then play three games in four days in Cleveland, plus they have to finish off their suspended August 31st match with the Clevelands, which was called with the Royals down 4-2 in the middle of the tenth. In other words, they almost certainly have one more loss on their record than it currently shows, Cleveland just has to do its part for a half inning next Monday to make it official. And we’ll probably want to see a whole lot more losses than that between now and then, as the Royals will leave Cleveland in the middle of next week to finish the season on the road for four with the shitty White Sox.

Rangers @ A’s
The Rangers’ downfall this season has been, truth be told, pretty hilarious. If they want to salvage some pride by beating up on the A’s both now and on the weekend after this, when they host them to close out the season, I can live with that.

Tigers @ Twins
We’re almost certainly going to be cheering for the Tigers to crush the Royals on the weekend — Detroit is currently 1.5 games up and looking more likely to be the AL Central winner — but… I dunno… at least one of those two could stand to collapse. For our sake. So let’s cheer for the Twins now anyway, if only to make things more interesting. It’s probably not going to mean much, though: the Tigers’ final four series of the year are at Minnesota, at Kansas City, hosting the shitty White Sox, and then hosting the Twins. They ought to feel pretty good about their chances.

Cleveland @ Astros, Yankees @ Rays
The Clevelands and Yankees are behind the Jays. Let’s keep it that way, eh ya shitbags?


And that’s not the only hot breaking scoop to pass along!

- Heyman: Sky Blue
- Heyman: Water Wet
- Heyman: Women’s Breasts Strangely Alluring

I know, I know, I was stunned too about the water thing.

Of course, what’s Heyman to do here? Not engage in clickbait? Shit, I clicked on it, and I knew there was going to be precisely zero of value to me in his piece. Then again, fans in other markets may be interested to know that the Jays are hypothetically willing to add a $15-million contract to their payroll, or that there is a baseball team in Canada named the Blue Jays — and that they actually play in the major leagues? Naomi Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaatts?

Heyman also pulls the trusty old high school trick of pumping up his fluff with a few filler paragraphs like this one:

Word from someone familiar with the Blue Jays’ thinking is that they are so pleased with Cabrera both on and off the field that it is an “easy decision” for them to make him a qualifying offer. Toronto actually hopes it leads to another multi-year arrangement with Cabrera, who should be one of the better hitters on a thin market.

No word on whether he adjusted the margins to make the piece look bigger.

Heyman also says he thinks Melky owes the Jays for believing in him when he was at his lowest point, coming off his P.E.D. suspension. Because that’s totally how this stuff usually works!

Don’t get me wrong, though, I’m all for it if Melky’s hellbent on re-signing here.

Anyway, I’m sure we’ll get an equally valuable piece when Cabrera inevitably declines. Frankly, I’m already breathless in anticipation.


Fuck. Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck.

Not going to lie: I operated for much of this fine-ish Monday that today was an off-day for the Jays. Guess not! Though it is an off-day for both Anthony Gose and, evidently, common goddamn sense.

That’s the only conclusion I can come to from tonight’s alignment of Jays outfielders, which sees the best centre fielder of the trio, Kevin Pillar, in left; the best right fielder, Jose Bautista, in centre; and John Mayberry in right.

I’m a huge fan of John Gibbons, but I have no idea what the hell that is all about — though it speaks, I think, to the unfortunate political nature of how this sort of stuff is among the guys actually in the clubhouse. Shi Davidi tweeted this afternoon that the alignment looks as it does because John Mayberry Jr. prefers to play in right. In no rational universe should that matter an iota, but a baseball clubhouse is hardly a rational universe — Jose Bautista prefers to hit third out of some bizarre point of pride, for example, which is the same reason a guy like Troy Tulowitzki says he’d rather retire than move off shortstop. On one hand you want to say, “You’re employees! You do what your bosses tell you! So bosses, tell them!!!” But on the other, we know they’re really not, and evidently it simply can’t work that way.

That, of course, is why we’re seeing Jose Reyes at shortstop again tonight as well, despite the fact that Ryan Goins is also on the field. And why we see things like Jeff Blair’s post this morning (was that really this morning???) at Sportsnet about the Jays not yet having broached the idea of a position change with their shortstop — even as he plays through injury, with a superior defender next to him on the field — and supposedly not aiming to in the off-season, either.

Oh, but “you can expect general manager Alex Anthopoulos and manager John Gibbons to tell Reyes in exit interviews that they will give him more off days next season – including some turns as a designated hitter, which Reyes has fought this season,” we’re told. And with new turf, and Brett Lawrie (hopefully) and Goins (not so much hopefully) providing cover, they think they’ll be able to hide him enough to be passable.

It’s fucking absurd. But it is what it is.

Still, though, say what you will for advanced defensive metrics, but how’s this for a puke-in-your-mouth comparison? This year by UZR Reyes has been 9.1 runs below average, and his DRS is -16. Guess who sits at a shitty-but-less-shitty -5.5 UZR and -10 DRS?

Yep. It’s Derek Jeter.

To be fair, Reyes has played more innings, over a bigger sample Jeter has been considerably worse, and Reyes is playing through an injury. But on the other hand… JESUS CHRIST!

Oh, hey, but at least the Jays also spent the weekend pissing away crucial games to the Rays, leading their more-improbable-than-ever playoff quest to Baltimore for three games starting tonight, then the Bronx for four.




Next game(s): Tomorrow, 7:05 PM ET @ Baltimore

For those of you who’ll be out and about, be sure to follow all the action on your phone with theScore app.

And now, the lineups… 

Toronto Blue Jays

SS Jose Reyes (S)
CF Jose Bautista (R)
DH Edwin Encarnacion (R)
C Dionner Navarro (S)
1B Danny Valencia (R)
RF John Mayberry Jr. (R)
3B Steve Tolleson (R)
LF Kevin Pillar (R)
2B Ryan Goins (L)

RHP Marcus Stroman

Baltimore Orioles

RF Nick Markakis (L)
LF Alejandro De Aza (L)
CF Adam Jones (R)
DH Nelson Cruz (R)
1B Steve Pearce (R)
SS J.J. Hardy (R)
3B Kelly Johnson (L)
2B Ryan Flaherty (L)
C Caleb Joseph (R)

LHP Wei-Yin Chen


Image via. (NSFW)


Another week, another Griff Bag! Aka Richard Griffin’s latest mail bag from over at the Toronto Star! On time and everything!


If there’s a question you’d like me to answer, unless it’s about fucking Ricky Romero and J.P. Arencibia, submit it to Griffin here, and maybe he’ll select it for a future mail bag. Fingers crossed!

Q-Richard Stoeten,

I have my doubts on whether Brandon Morrow can ever be healthy for a full season as a starter. However, we only have to look to Dustin McGowan to see how well his body holds up coming out of the bullpen. My question is, with Morrow’s stuff, is he the Jays’ closer of the future?

Dr. Justin

Richmond Hill, ON

Morrow wants to start — and why shouldn’t he? He stands to make a whole lot more money in his career if he’s a starter than if he’s a reliever, and there’s probably going to be a team that will give him an opportunity — something the Jays, seemingly with too many starters for too few spots as it is, given the fact that Dan Norris and Aaron Sanchez ought to both join the rotation in 2015, can’t. Their only way to keep him, it therefore seems, would be to pick up his $10-million club option.

It will cost them $1-million if they don’t pick it up, but still, adding $9-millions to the payroll just for sixty-odd innings? Good as we may think Morrow is, there are very, very few pitchers you’d contemplate paying so much for so little. Add in his injury history. Add in the fact that everyone expects the team will be limited in its ability to add to payroll. And add in the fact that they’ll be searching for multiple bullpen pieces, given the questionable status of Steve Delabar, the loss of Neil Wagner and Sergio Santos, the potential departure of Casey Janssen, and potentially even the loss of Dustin McGowan — who, if we’re being honest, probably hasn’t been good enough to justify picking up his own $4-million option — and spending all that money on Morrow alone looks, frankly, crazy as fuck.

If this was a team with more budget room or looking for one last bullpen piece it might be a worthwhile gamble — Morrow still has a whole lot of talent, to be sure — but it isn’t. That money can be better spent elsewhere.



Q-Mr. Griffin Stoeten,

As much as you do say that the Jays have the money to sign Melky Cabrera (and I do want him to stay in Toronto), and I was a big backer of the man coming here, I do not see that happening.

Reason 1: Weak outfield free agent market. You yourself have said that other outfielders include (Nelson) Cruz, (Torii) Hunter & (Alex) Rios. Cruz has done very well in Baltimore and with what they have built there it would be strange for him to leave as he is having massive success there. Hunter though is going to be 40 during the next season, and while he has played well his .275 average is good but his on base percentage is lower than Cruz and with age creeping in who knows how he will hold up, and as such Melky is ten years younger. Rios has cooled down a little but is hitting a very respectable .280 and has been durable, doesn’t have the power Melky has which isn’t terrible considering you aren’t looking for power from the 2-hole, but would he want to actually come back to the city that chased him away? I don’t think so.

Reason 2: Winning. This team in the two years Melky has been here has not been a winner and it seems like the management group does not know how to construct a team as you have a top 4 of very good to excellent hitters, but after that you lack much in the lineup as proven all year. 163 home runs, but 87 of them have come from EE, Bats, Reyes & Melky. This would mean you would need an overhaul of the bottom 5 (except Navarro, but a better backup catcher would be needed).

Reason 3: Pre-existing Financial Commitments. The Jays have already tied up $94MM in guaranteed money in just 8 players for next year and 1 of those players is Rickey Romero, so you have just 7 roster players out of 26 signed. Considering the team payroll this year is $137MM and between the two years Rogers has spent $250MM for no playoff spots you can’t assume they will increase payroll.

Reason 4: Poor Drafting Record. The Jays while having some of the best young talented arms in all of baseball have at the opposite end of the spectrum failed miserably at drafting position players. Currently the only position players that were in the minors on August 31 who would be considered real prospects were Dalton Pompey, Anthony Gose, A.J. Jimenez. Gose & Jimenez are both 24 and it is time for them to prove that they are major league players or if they are going to be just backups/bench players in baseball. Last year was Yan Gomes breakout year into a starting role and he was 25, if you aren’t a major league every day player by 25, chances are you won’t be (Yan Gomes WAR is 4.1, better than all Jays but JBats). After those 3 players there isn’t anyone below 25 in AAA or AA and that is a failure of Alex A to draft position players and as such when we have an injury you have NOTHING to replace it with. How come people complain the Leafs don’t build through the draft but the Jays are allowed to get away with it.

As such these are 4 excellent reasons why Melky would not necessarily sign back with us as he is valuable to many other teams in baseball, especially ones who have a chance to win soon which he would be more interested in doing as the way this team has been put together shows that it is not a winner.

Ian Serota

I’ll actually answer this, but first a disclaimer: this is a serious fucking load of garbage clown idiocy. To wit:

1) Why are you talking about the weak market as a reason why the Jays won’t re-sign Melky and then seemingly discussing why the Jays may or may not be interested in certain guys? This was one of your two not completely shitty points, and you totally blew it. The fact is, the dearth of other good free agent outfielders is definitely working against the Jays. Plenty of teams will have strong interest in a guy like Melky, though that will be mitigated by his P.E.D. suspension in 2012, and by the fact that the Jays will make him a qualifying offer, meaning the team that signs him will be forced to give up their highest unprotected draft pick to do so. How that has anything to do with crying about Alex Rios not wanting to come back is beyond me.

2) This is utter stupidity and not at all a factor.

3) Most people are assuming that the Jays will be in the $140-million range again, which — after the expected free agent losses and arbitration raises — gives them something close to the $15-million it’s hoped it will take to re-sign Cabrera. Moving Mark Buehrle and getting a team to take on a whole bunch of his salary would add even more to the potential payroll for the club — assuming Rogers allows them to keep the savings — but yes, this is a major factor why he may not return. Coupled with number one, it’s the biggest factor.

4) More stupidity. Yes, the Jays do not have a wealth of position prospects knocking at the door — though Gose, Pillar, and Pompey are certainly not nothing — but before you call that a failure, maybe try understanding in the slightest what the fuck you’re talking about. The reality is, that was by design. Anthopoulos long ago made the decision that it was more important for him to acquire pitching than hitting, under the belief that it is easier to acquire hitters by other means. Quibble with that notion if you want, but don’t be an asshole and scream “poor draft record.” Alex’s first draft as GM was in 2010, and it was at that point that the Jays truly started focussing in on high school players, and pitchers in particular. What you see among the big talents in the Jays’ minor league system, therefore, is exactly what you’d expect: a lot of young players, most of them pitchers. But even if he had been drafting more position players, consider this: a high school draftee from 2010 is now around just 22 years old. Aaron Sanchez is one of them, and he’s just now reaching the big leagues, and one of the youngest pitchers in the majors. To repeat: a prototypical guy from A.A.’s first draft is now an exceptionally young big leaguer. Hey, but let’s whine about where all the other, younger draftees, from even more recent drafts are — because that’s not dumb. Hey, and while we’re at it let’s be garbage clowns and whine about Yan Gomes, too.

And this has what to do with Cabrera coming back? Besides jack shit all, I mean.

That all said, there is definitely a very big chance that the Jays won’t be able to resign Cabrera, and it’s entirely related to money and the market for him. It’s not clear how that will develop. The Jays are surely hoping that the P.E.D. thing and the qualifying offer suppress the market enough that they can make a competitive offer given their budget limitations. But on the pessimistic side, a guy like Shin-Soo Choo, who last winter signed a seven-year, $130-million deal with Texas, is an interesting, if imperfect comp.

Choo declined the qualifying offer given to him by the Reds, so the Rangers gave up a high pick to get him, in addition to the massive contract. He was also a year older last winter than Cabrera is now, and similarly is a poor defensive outfielder, but a terrific bat, even while being a liability against left-handed pitching. There are general similarities between the two players, and so that is the contract Cabrera’s agent is surely looking at as his best case scenario, and one that I don’t think the Jays would come close to matching — and I don’t think anyone would blame them if they didn’t.

There are definitely differences between the two players that suggest it’s fanciful for Cabrera’s agent to be dreaming on a similar deal, though too. Choo had avoided the DL for the two seasons heading into his free agency; he certainly seems to have a body type that screams longevity more than Cabrera’s does *COUGH*; Melky has two significantly below replacement level seasons in the last five years on his resume, one because of a spinal tumour, one in his pre-P.E.D. season in Atlanta where he was reportedly badly out of shape; Choo had always shown an above average ability to get on base, but in his walk year he produced an elite walk rate of over 15%, leading to a .423 on-base (Melky’s walk year OBP is just .351); while the defensive metrics like neither player, the Reds thought Choo was good enough to play centrefield regularly in 2013, which might reflect better on him in the field (even though it was crazy); Choo’s career ISO (.171) is 42 points higher than Cabrera’s (.129); and Choo has been a significantly better player by both versions of WAR.

To expand on that last point, over their five season heading into free agency Choo nearly doubled Cabrera’s rWAR total (20.7 to 11.5). Make if four years — taking away a very good season from Choo and a bad one from Cabrera — and Choo still has the advantage by over three wins (15.2 to 11.9). Fangraphs’ version of the metric tells a similar story: Cabrera has produced 8.5 wins over five seasons, and (removing his awful 2010 in Atlanta) 10 wins over the last four; for Choo, as he headed into free agency, it was 19.6 and 14.8. Change the endpoints and the story stays about the same.

So… add all that to the fact that Melky has the P.E.D. issue looming over him, and that Choo’s contract already looks like a pretty big mistake from Jon Daniels , and I don’t see a team getting anywhere near that level with Cabrera, even if the market for outfielders is weak. Only time will tell, though. And the bigger point is that those market-based things are the sorts of factors that will determine whether the Jays will be able to bring him back, not whatever litany of whiny irrelevant nonsense some garbage clown wants to try to shoehorn into a half-assed argument about why he’d be unwilling to do so.


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